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Tech companies are telling immigrant employees on visas not to leave the U.S.

washingtonpost.com

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Re: Tech companies are telling immigrant employees on visas not to leave the U.S.

#81

Post by toast0 »

occz wrote: post #33
zombiwoof wrote: post #24

[flagged]

No countries readily jail people who have the legal right to enter that country as the U.S is currently doing, but if you wish, a reciprocal policy for U.S citizens traveling abroad can certainly be arranged.

Having a visa doesn't give you the right to enter. I don't think permanent residency does either.

It's always at the discretion of the immigration officer and there's no recourse if they don't let you in.

Personally, I don't think it's generally reasonable to jail at entry when denying entry is an option. The case where the UK tourist was denied entry to Canada from the US and then was jailed in the US is a case where denying entry isn't really possible, because if neither side of a land border will allow entry, what do uou do... but then it shouldn't have taken more than a couple days to make arrangements for her to fly home on her own dime.

Re: Tech companies are telling immigrant employees on visas not to leave the U.S.

#82

Post by nice_byte »

at this point, what's even the point of immigrating here? if you're still young and haven't rooted yourself to this place (no family / house / significant other), I'd advise to leave and look to build a life in a different country. the best years of your life would be better lived elsewhere.

Re: Tech companies are telling immigrant employees on visas not to leave the U.S.

#83

Post by atmavatar »

MPSFounder wrote: post #44
BrenBarn wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The law is unfortunately very vague and thus open to interpretation (which is ultimately subject to the commander in chief, the current clown) That is it exactly. The US legal/governmental system is a house of cards that has been running for at least 150 years on a bunch of wink-wink-nudge-nudge assumptions that both sides were too scared to test or even acknowledge. An ounce of prevention might have been worth a p…

The truth is much of it could have been prevented (court packing was one idea that might have been unpopular, but there are many other ideas that could have been acted upon). We live with consequences of failures of the Democratic party for the last decade. Had Ruth Ginsberg been pressured to retire after her numerous health issues, Roe v Wade would never have been overturned (it was a 1 vote swing). Had primaries oc…

> We live with consequences of failures of the Democratic party for the last decade.

While that's not completely wrong, I find it fascinating that everyone seems to treat the Republican party as having no culpability. We have a Republican party that's had a policy goal of blowing up the government for a half century with varying levels of how far they were willing to take it, but it's the Democratic party's fault for not saving us from them and the voters that support them.

Re: Tech companies are telling immigrant employees on visas not to leave the U.S.

#84

Post by toomuchtodo »

lazyasciiart wrote: post #31
SanjayMehta wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

At two different US companies I had to attend training led by a lawyer on how to file H1b and L1 applications, how to write recruitment ads and coaching visa applicants for their interviews. Both training programmes were surprisingly similar, even two years apart. No notes were allowed. No slides. Even the call for attendance was verbal and in person. This is a US corporation problem, not the US government’s.

The government wrote the rules those classes are teaching you to meet.

Perhaps the last government, but not this one.

Re: Tech companies are telling immigrant employees on visas not to leave the U.S.

#85

Post by tgma »

jasonjayr wrote: post #79
tgma wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I mean, I was discussing the law, now we pivot to emotions? The "masked" guys immediately showed their badges if we are talking about the same incident. When you come to the US on a visa, you should not be under any illusions that is not the case. In fact, a US visa is not even guarantee of entry to the US as you are reminded when you get one. I am not aware if any other country behaves differently if they want a for…

You started with "Stir the pot in the media", and brought emotions into it. But the point still stands. Legal does not mean moral. And there is a legal obligation to represent the will of all the people of the country, not just those that elected you. Clearly, the law needs to spell out exactly what legally needs to be done in the case of an expideient deportation, so it codifies some sense of common morality. But to…

The law spells out exactly what can be done. Your issue is you don't like the law and want more leniency for the alien, which is a fine position to argue, but that is not the law that has been on the books for 30+ years.

I don't want to debate my opinion on the merits of the current law; clearly we can agree/disagree on some of the points on how it should be written, but I will respond your questions with a different one: do you really believe that there are absolutely zero foreign actors/implants on student visas? If not, you should at least give some deference to the US government intelligence apparatus to know what they are doing. They have reportedly cancelled 300 visas? If it were 10x more, I would start to worry, but 300 sounds like security apparatus functioning properly.

Re: Tech companies are telling immigrant employees on visas not to leave the U.S.

#86

Post by vkou »

dboreham wrote: post #60
MPSFounder wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The truth is much of it could have been prevented (court packing was one idea that might have been unpopular, but there are many other ideas that could have been acted upon). We live with consequences of failures of the Democratic party for the last decade. Had Ruth Ginsberg been pressured to retire after her numerous health issues, Roe v Wade would never have been overturned (it was a 1 vote swing). Had primaries oc…

Freedom and justice should not depend on these kind of game show tactics. The system should be more resilient. Unfortunately it isn't due to the culture and social norms of the country.

There isn't a system in the universe that can be resilient against a compromised executive, legislature, and judiciary. Of the three, the judiciary is the least compromised, and it is currently the only one pushing back, but it can only do so much.

At the end of the day, you have to not keep voting in criminals.

Re: Tech companies are telling immigrant employees on visas not to leave the U.S.

#87

Post by wetpaws »

occz wrote: post #33
zombiwoof wrote: post #24

[flagged]

No countries readily jail people who have the legal right to enter that country as the U.S is currently doing, but if you wish, a reciprocal policy for U.S citizens traveling abroad can certainly be arranged.

[dead]

Re: Tech companies are telling immigrant employees on visas not to leave the U.S.

#88

Post by nxhxgs »

MPSFounder wrote: post #12
Teever wrote: post #10

I'm super interested to see what the next HN thread with that proberts lawyer dude is like. I found the commentary in the last post from him to be pretty meagre, whether it was because people were afraid to talk about this kind of stuff or they just didn't know, I'm not sure, but it seems like reality is quickly setting in for a lot of people in the US. Things are changing and they're changing fast. You won't be able…

The most interesting thing I see is people overestimate how resilient the system is. Unfortunately, this is at the whim of a president, who with a majority in the court, dictates the law. With a ban or at his whim, even legal residents can find themselves out. We tend to think the system is resilient to this, but ultimately it really isn't. Scholars cannot even agree on whether these tech workers are entitled to the…

Its not like immigrants have had wonderful, controllable and predictable paths to residency in the past. For those who arent Einstein or belong to the over rated HN crowd, the system has always be exploitative. Anyone who isnt born rich and has been through the process has had to live with constant fear, doubt and uncertainty.

Re: Tech companies are telling immigrant employees on visas not to leave the U.S.

#89

Post by cjbgkagh »

tgma wrote: post #71
MPSFounder wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I stand corrected. US nationals refers to something else, but is sometimes used to include permanent residents alongside citizens. I am not familiar with the terminology, but my point stands. A legal permanent resident is very different from the situation you are citing, and I think if you believe they are not entitled to free speech (in particular, for offending a foreign country), we have a much bigger problem here…

The terminology makes all the difference, though. You cannot just handwave it away. A US National is not removable by the discretion of U.S. Secretary of State, but a LPR can be found deportable based on that. The law could not be more clear. This is not a First Amendment concern. You don't have to commit a crime or to be charged with one. Even your mere presence is enough to trigger the statute. You can debate if Ru…

In general the people making appeals to freedom of speech as a traditionally held cultural value are the same ones who not long ago espoused that freedom of speech does not mean freedom from consequences.

It was a bad idea then, it’s a bad idea now, but I would have much more sympathy for the left had they maintained a tradition of freedom of speech as a cultural value throughout and not only when its convenient for them.

Re: Tech companies are telling immigrant employees on visas not to leave the U.S.

#90

Post by OccamsMirror »

atmavatar wrote: post #83
MPSFounder wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The truth is much of it could have been prevented (court packing was one idea that might have been unpopular, but there are many other ideas that could have been acted upon). We live with consequences of failures of the Democratic party for the last decade. Had Ruth Ginsberg been pressured to retire after her numerous health issues, Roe v Wade would never have been overturned (it was a 1 vote swing). Had primaries oc…

> We live with consequences of failures of the Democratic party for the last decade. While that's not completely wrong, I find it fascinating that everyone seems to treat the Republican party as having no culpability. We have a Republican party that's had a policy goal of blowing up the government for a half century with varying levels of how far they were willing to take it, but it's the Democratic party's fault for…

Well if the adults don't put up a toddler gate, who's fault is it when the toddler falls down the stairs?
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