This timeline is so bad, it is increasingly hard to dismiss the possibility that that is not the product of change, but rather the product of being in an absolutely shitty simulation.
Zelensky leaves White House after angry meeting
81–90 of 1001 posts
Re: Zelensky leaves White House after angry meeting
#82It looks like the US wants a regime change in Ukraine, it's possible that this became a pre condition from russia for talks to go forward.
OTOH, a minerals deal with the US ensures that the US will have a stake in defending the postwar ukraine.
Lots of drama and optics involved for sure, but it seems the outcome or the talks was predetermined
JdVance will not last for long - is there procedure to replace him?
Re: Zelensky leaves White House after angry meeting
#83Ukraine is in a bind, and the US has the power to do whatever it wants. But boy, will the nations of the world remember this -- how quickly the US can turn from ally to bully. A really bad day for US foreign policy. The EU is going to be thinking long and hard about the future of NATO now.
Well most of the nations of the world didn't do anything for Ukraine, or supported Russia one way or the other.
Maybe a lot of them see the US and/or the Western countries as bullies anyway.
edit: not sure by which part of the world this is downvoted ;)
Re: Zelensky leaves White House after angry meeting
#84It looks like the US wants a regime change in Ukraine, it's possible that this became a pre condition from russia for talks to go forward. OTOH, a minerals deal with the US ensures that the US will have a stake in defending the postwar ukraine. Lots of drama and optics involved for sure, but it seems the outcome or the talks was predetermined JdVance will not last for long - is there procedure to replace him?
> OTOH, a minerals deal with the US ensures that the US will have a stake in defending the postwar ukraine.
Most of the minerals are in russian-occupied territory, so if they want that they would also need to further arm Ukraine now.
Re: Zelensky leaves White House after angry meeting
#85[dead]
Re: Zelensky leaves White House after angry meeting
#86Zelensky just proved once again what real leadership looks like.
He went to the White House knowing that they will try to do exactly that and yet he did it with his head held high and did not sign the deal. Amazing guy.
This is also a historic day for the world. US dominance over the West is over.
As a European, I will vote against any politician that keeps talking about EU-US special partnership and doesn't put 'EU First'. The special partnership is over, we are still doing business together but it's clear as a day that it's only business from now on.
Re: Zelensky leaves White House after angry meeting
#87Sorry about the podcast link, the gist is that Ukraine now can build drones from cardboard, controlled from Kiev, London etc. that can destroy Russian tanks. https://www.ft.com/content/8793e218-9dc4-43a8-8183-e2a092bbb...
"We've seen that international law doesn't really work, but international engineering is very effective"
I would not bet against Ukraine.
Re: Zelensky leaves White House after angry meeting
#88What sparked this heated discussion? Zelensky asked JD what if Putin breaks the agreed diplomacy as he had done previously?
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Re: Zelensky leaves White House after angry meeting
#89This is how NATO replaces the US with Ukraine. Kicking the US out of Five Eyes is likely next.
I don’t see this happening. Five Eyes is the US’s invite only security umbrella. Many in Australia would love to kick the Americans off our land (eg Pinegap) but as the US will “coup who they want” that ain’t happening.
Re: Zelensky leaves White House after angry meeting
#90It was as if they invited him to the Whitehouse to set him up for a lecture and scolding. They had no intention of anything other than humiliating him in front of the world. It's shameful what our administration has done.
So it was just like literally everything else this administration is doing. Shocking.