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JetBrains Fleet drops support for Kotlin Multiplatform

blog.jetbrains.com

81–90 of 276 posts

Re: JetBrains Fleet drops support for Kotlin Multiplatform

#81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think Fleet's their hopeful answer to VSCode. IntelliJ is powerful, but so, so messy, with a convoluted UI from the 90s/2000s. Even the simplified one is much klunklier than VSCode, especially for everyday/every-hour tasks like NPM scripts, debugging, etc. Every essential function is hidden in tiny competing side panels triggered by some obscure icon in a different part of the screen. I love and use Jetbrains IDEs…

My only problem with jetbrains UI is that it's slow. Night and day difference using even vscode, let alone vim, sublime, helix, zed, etc. I tolerate it because the functionality it brings, but I find myself actually writing code in something faster. And I don't see fleet improving on this in a meaningful way - it's basically a competitor to vscode, which I don't use for the same reasons I won't use fleet. There is a…

Exactly this. Every time I revisit a Jetbrains product, I uninstall it within 5 minutes. It doesn't matter how great the features are, it's just sluggish.

People can rag on Electron apps all they like, but VSCode on modern hardware is very snappy. Jetbrains is a noticeable downgrade.

Re: JetBrains Fleet drops support for Kotlin Multiplatform

#82

I wish Jet brains would give AI features for free for some time, Github co pilot will be incompatible with fleet for some time and even with other legacy jetbrain IDEs like webstorm / pycharm it does not work very well. They always release features for vs code first and then webstorm follows.

CoPilot has been working fairly well for me in GoLand. I don't know if Copilot has the same or more support in Goland than in Webstorm/Pycharm, so, if the latter, my observation might well be disjoint from yours.

But so far, it's a moderately capable assistant. My biggest complaints with it have more to do with its responses than its fit with the IDE.

Re: JetBrains Fleet drops support for Kotlin Multiplatform

#83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think Fleet's their hopeful answer to VSCode. IntelliJ is powerful, but so, so messy, with a convoluted UI from the 90s/2000s. Even the simplified one is much klunklier than VSCode, especially for everyday/every-hour tasks like NPM scripts, debugging, etc. Every essential function is hidden in tiny competing side panels triggered by some obscure icon in a different part of the screen. I love and use Jetbrains IDEs…

> Many of my colleagues try them out for an hour or two and then jump ship back to VSCode just because the initial "wtf is going on" factor is so high =/ Really? I mean, the UIs are basically the same now. I have them open side by side on my desktop right now and they're both: - black boxes with a panel on the left of icons, then a tree of files, then a tabbed pane of open files. - clicking on the icons on the left o…

On the topic of keyboard shortcuts I use both IntelliJ IDEs and VSCode every day.

IntelliJ ships a “VSCode” keymap in the product that you can switch to with one option in the settings.

Re: JetBrains Fleet drops support for Kotlin Multiplatform

#85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Many of my colleagues try them out for an hour or two and then jump ship back to VSCode just because the initial "wtf is going on" factor is so high =/ Really? I mean, the UIs are basically the same now. I have them open side by side on my desktop right now and they're both: - black boxes with a panel on the left of icons, then a tree of files, then a tabbed pane of open files. - clicking on the icons on the left o…

On the topic of keyboard shortcuts I use both IntelliJ IDEs and VSCode every day. IntelliJ ships a “VSCode” keymap in the product that you can switch to with one option in the settings.

VSCode also has a plugin for IntelliJ keybindings FWIW.

Re: JetBrains Fleet drops support for Kotlin Multiplatform

#86

I wish Jet brains would give AI features for free for some time, Github co pilot will be incompatible with fleet for some time and even with other legacy jetbrain IDEs like webstorm / pycharm it does not work very well. They always release features for vs code first and then webstorm follows.

CoPilot has been working fairly well for me in GoLand. I don't know if Copilot has the same or more support in Goland than in Webstorm/Pycharm, so, if the latter, my observation might well be disjoint from yours. But so far, it's a moderately capable assistant. My biggest complaints with it have more to do with its responses than its fit with the IDE.

Have you tried co pilot with vs code ?

Re: JetBrains Fleet drops support for Kotlin Multiplatform

#87

I still don't understand where Jetbrains is going with Fleet. Is it a platform to prototype ideas for their IDEs? Is their long-term goal to replace their IDEs with Fleet? Is it just a standalone product? So far, it seems like they're very slowly recreating their IDEs from scratch in Fleet while continuing development on the IntelliJ Platform and related IDEs, doing twice as much work for nothing.

I've been hoping that Fleet would emerge as a true multi language IDE. I code in GoLang and Python regularly. I currently have the Python plugin in Goland which is not the professional plugin. If I want them I have to use a different IDE and switching back and forth is a pain.

Also, with a rewrite I've hoped that remote development will be less buggy than it currently is with Goland. It's laggy too and you see weird screen flashes. Sometimes certain features don't even work over remote.

Re: JetBrains Fleet drops support for Kotlin Multiplatform

#88
Most comments here either praise IDEA-variants as "outstanding", or blame it for being "slow and complicated", both of which feel odd to me (especially the first one). I strongly prefer JetBrains products over anything else, so if it's possible to use PyCharm, I will use PyCharm instead of Vim/VSCode. Yet I cannot imagine calling it outstanding. Maybe, that's just my bad character overall, but I just am surprised why is it that all IDEs/code editors suck so much. About 5 years ago, when LSP appeared (introduced by VSCode IIRC), many people predicted that soon they will far surpass IDEA's (and the likes) autocompletion, etc. And honestly, I believed them. Why wouldn't it? It seems like a simple task, once you have generic LSP functionality, the rest should be "just details", like finding/making good data source for particular language/lib/etc.

And all that JetBrains IDEs do, feels to me like a pretty simple stuff. Like all these refactoring options (pretty much the main reason why I prefer their IDEs over simpler editors, it feels like a natural extension of Vim keybindings: why should I do anything as simple as extracting a method manually?), it seems like a thing that should be easily scriptable once you have powerful code-editing API, so I feel annoyed by the fact they are pretty much "hard-coded" into IDE and I cannot easily add a couple of my own simple refactorings. BTW, they didn't really change over the last 5 years or so. Some bugs get fixed, static code analysis gets smarter and more specialized for a current version of some language, but nothing that would feel like real progress. It's hundreds of tiny distinct things, and it seems like that would progress much faster, if all these things were open-source plugins. As people predicted, when LSP came about. Yet apparently it doesn't, because as imperfect PyCharm is, VSCode cannot do even as much.

So, basically, what distinguishes IDEA from anything else seem like super simple things, and it seems weird that for it it must compromise to use that clunky, configurable via UI (instead of neat JSON/TOML/whatever), memory-hungry IDE. And it still puzzles me. Of course, if it seems so simple, it's fair to ask why I didn't make my own yet. Well, yes, I didn't even look into it. But I just cannot understand, what's the hard problem that community struggles to solve, why all opensource or semi-opensource editors didn't leave clunky "traditioinal IDEs" far behind yet with regard to these core function, even though it seems those traditional IDEs haven't evolved for years?

Re: JetBrains Fleet drops support for Kotlin Multiplatform

#89

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My only problem with jetbrains UI is that it's slow. Night and day difference using even vscode, let alone vim, sublime, helix, zed, etc. I tolerate it because the functionality it brings, but I find myself actually writing code in something faster. And I don't see fleet improving on this in a meaningful way - it's basically a competitor to vscode, which I don't use for the same reasons I won't use fleet. There is a…

Exactly this. Every time I revisit a Jetbrains product, I uninstall it within 5 minutes. It doesn't matter how great the features are, it's just sluggish. People can rag on Electron apps all they like, but VSCode on modern hardware is very snappy. Jetbrains is a noticeable downgrade.

Weird. None of my PCs have cpus made after 2018. After the initial indexing, things are fast. I guess that's what you're running into on startup.

Re: JetBrains Fleet drops support for Kotlin Multiplatform

#90
post #13

This is definitely surprising given they announced a KMP standalone IDE only a few months ago. For now, Flutter still seems to make more sense than KMP while the KMP world is still maturing.

Dart is an amazing and underrated language too. It compiles to native assembly, has pattern matching, async/await, and null safety. The only thing it's missing in my opinion is some form of checked errors, currently they only have unchecked exceptions.

i find its biggest problem is its json ecosystem; very clunky and boilerplate-y
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