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Extracting AI models from mobile apps

altayakkus.substack.com

81–90 of 250 posts

Re: Extracting AI models from mobile apps

#81
post #4

“ Keep in mind that AI models, like most things, are considered intellectual property. Before using or modifying any extracted models, you need the explicit permission of their owner.” That’s not true, is it? It would be a copyright violation to distribute an extracted model, but you can do what you want with it yourself.

its insane to state it tbh

Re: Extracting AI models from mobile apps

#82
post #4

“ Keep in mind that AI models, like most things, are considered intellectual property. Before using or modifying any extracted models, you need the explicit permission of their owner.” That’s not true, is it? It would be a copyright violation to distribute an extracted model, but you can do what you want with it yourself.

Circumventing a copy-prevention system without a valid exemption is a crime, even if you don't make unlawful copies. Copyright covers the right to make copies, not the right to distribute; "doing what you want with it yourself" may or may not be covered by fair use. Whether or not model weights are copyrightable remains an open question. https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/17/1201

just imagine, like just for a second how it becomes illegal to train anything that does not then afterwards produce, if publicly used or distributed, a copyright token which is both in the training set - to mark it - and in the produce - to recognize it.

so this is where it all goes in several years, if i were the gov.

Re: Extracting AI models from mobile apps

#83
post #80

You wouldn't train a LLM on a corpus containing copyrighted works without ensuring you had the necessary rights to the works, would you?

You wouldn't read a book and teach others its lessons without a derived license, would you?

copyright refers to the act of copying the material at hand (including distribution, reproduction, performance) etc.

as an example: saying “i really like james holden’s inheritors album for the rough and dissonant sounds” isn’t covered by copyright.

if i reproduced it verbatim using my mouth, or created a derived work which is noticeably similar to the original, that’s a different question though.

in your example, a derivative work example could be akin to only quoting from the book for the audience and modifying a word of each quote.

“derived” works are always a grey area, especially around generative machine learning right now.

Re: Extracting AI models from mobile apps

#84
post #6

Can anyone explain that resize_to_320.tflite file? Surely they aren't using an AI model to resize images? Right?

tflite files can contain a ResizeOp that resizes the image: https://ai.google.dev/edge/api/tflite/java/org/tensorflow/li... The file is only 7.7kb, so it couldn't contain many weights anyways.

Exactly. Put another way, tensorflow is not an AI. You can build an AI in tensorflow. You can also resize images in tensorflow (using the traditional algorithms, not AI). I am not an expert, but as I understand, it is common for vision models to require a fixed resolution input, and it is common for that resolution to be quite low due to resource constraints.

Re: Extracting AI models from mobile apps

#85
post #16

Well done you seem to have liberated an open model trained on open data for blind and visually impaired people. Paper: https://arxiv.org/pdf/2204.03738 Code: https://github.com/microsoft/banknote-net Training data: https://raw.githubusercontent.com/microsoft/banknote-net/ref... model: https://github.com/microsoft/banknote-net/blob/main/models/b... Kinda easier to download it straight from github. Its licenced under M…

If this is exactly the same model then what's the point of encrypting it?

Re: Extracting AI models from mobile apps

#86
post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Going a step further, weights, i.e. coefficients, aren't produced by a person at all – they're produced by machine algorithms. Because a human did not create the weights, the weights have no author. Thus they are ineligible for copyright in the first place and are in the public domain. Whether the model architecture is copyrightable is more of an open question, but I think a solid argument could be that the model arc…

You can say the same about compiled executable code though.

Each compiled executable has a one-to-one relation with its source code, which has an author (except for LLM code and/or infinite monkeys). Thus compiled executables are derivative works.

There is an argument also that LLMs are derivative works of the training data, which I'm somewhat sympathetic to, though clearly there's a difference and lots of ambiguity about which contributions to which weights correspond to any particular source work.

Again IANAL, and this is my opinion based on reading the law & precedents. Consult a real copyright attorney for real advice.

Re: Extracting AI models from mobile apps

#87
post #80

You wouldn't train a LLM on a corpus containing copyrighted works without ensuring you had the necessary rights to the works, would you?

You wouldn't read a book and teach others its lessons without a derived license, would you?

When I was at school, we were sometimes all sat down in front of a TV to watch some movie on VHS tape (it was the 90s).

At the start of the tape, there was a copyright notice forbidding the VHS tape from being played at, amongst other places, schools.

Copyright rules are a strange thing.

Re: Extracting AI models from mobile apps

#88
post #65
post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes nothing wrong with cool software or showing people how to use it for useful things. Sorry I'm just kind of sick of the whole 'kool aid', 'rage against AI' thing a lot of people seem to have going on and the way is presented in the post. I have family members with vision impairment helped by this particular app so its a bit personal. Nothing against opening stuff up and understanding how it works etc. I'd just rat…

Sadly companies will hoard datasets and model research in the name of competitive advantage. Obviously with this specific model Microsoft chose to make it open, but this is not always the case, and it's not uncommon to read papers or technical reports saying they trained on an "internal dataset"

Companies do have a lot of data, and some of that data might be useful for training AI. but >99% isn't. When companies do release a cool model or paper that doesn't have open data, (as you point out for competitive or other reasons privacy etc) people can then help build/collect similar open datasets. Unfortunately companies generally don't owe you their data, and if they are in the business of making models they probably won't share the model either, the situation is similar to source code for proprietary LoB applications. but fortunately the best AI researchers mostly do like to share their knowledge and because companies want to attract the best AI researchers they seem to generally allow researchers to publish if its not too commercially sensitive. It could be worse while the competitive situation has reduced some visibility of the cutting edge science, lots of datasets and papers are still published.

Re: Extracting AI models from mobile apps

#89

You wouldn't train a LLM on a corpus containing copyrighted works without ensuring you had the necessary rights to the works, would you?

You’re applying a double standard to LLM’s and human creators. Any human writer or artist or filmmaker or musician will be influenced by other people’s works, even while those works are still under copyright.

Re: Extracting AI models from mobile apps

#90

You wouldn't train a LLM on a corpus containing copyrighted works without ensuring you had the necessary rights to the works, would you?

Fair use.

*only available in the USA, terms and conditions apply.

most other places use fair dealing which is more restrictive https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fair_dealing

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