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Tesla reports 1.1% sales drop for 2024, first annual decline in at least 9 years

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Re: Tesla reports 1.1% sales drop for 2024, first annual decline in at least 9 years

#81

Post by avgDev »

light_hue_1 wrote: post #75
SoftTalker wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think it's more simply that the market of people who want an EV and can afford a Tesla is now saturated.

I don't think so. At least from my personal experiences I know of at least a dozen sales that 3 years ago they would have made hands now. People compromise and buy what are clearly worse cars to avoid the Tesla brand. A friend just brought an ioniq a few months ago, same friend who was salivating over our Tesla a few years ago and kept talking about buying one endlessly. Guess why they didn't buy one.. Heck. I'm one…

I don't think Tesla can get rid of Musk.

If investors saw Tesla as just a car company the stock would collapse. Musk keeps making promises and breaking them, but it seems to pump the stock thus far.

Re: Tesla reports 1.1% sales drop for 2024, first annual decline in at least 9 years

#82

Post by fredfoo »

dauertewigkeit wrote: post #31
davidw wrote: post #14

I'm nearly 50. I'm used to the idea of businesses owners having different politics than my own, but mostly that was the sort of self-interested "I'm wealthy and I think wealthy people should pay fewer taxes and their businesses should be subject to fewer regulations" sorts of things. You can disagree without thinking they're necessarily Bad People or worthy of boycotting their businesses. Indeed, it's the hallmark of…

Why is Musk be loud about his politics worse than other billionaires being quiet but equally active in the political scene? It's good to know where these people stand.

The quiet billionaires put up something they care a great deal about. Musk's nonsenses in the US can be interpreted many ways but his screwing Germany and the UK with his incoherent stoner thoughts is basically letting off steam at everyone's expense because a lot of people are too stupid to understand how compartmentalized success is and that he doesn't necessarily even know who he is talking about.

Re: Tesla reports 1.1% sales drop for 2024, first annual decline in at least 9 years

#83

Post by JumpCrisscross »

mbesto wrote: post #58

My friend said it best: "EVs are great second cars" I think we're finally hitting the saturation point of EVs as the market who adopted them is realizing their flaws as a primary vehicle: - Inadequate infrastructure (both localized "my apartment doesn't have a charging station" and more globally "I stopped at a supercharger station and it was full of people so my charge went from 100 kW to 15 kW and took 45 min to ch…

> reality is it's not me that's saying this, the used car market is saying this. EVs simply don't hold their value on the used market

Those data defy simple explanation. The car with the highest 5-year depreciation is the Maserati Quattroporte (64.5%). After that the BMW 7 Series (61.8%) and Maserati Ghibli (61.3%).

So for starters, you have to control for (a) sports and (b) expensive cars. Niches EVs have targeted. The Model 3 is shown to have a 42.9% 5-year depreciation, around the category average for SUVs.

Re: Tesla reports 1.1% sales drop for 2024, first annual decline in at least 9 years

#84

Post by canucker2016 »

bryanlarsen wrote: post #63
cchance wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That includes hybrids though :S

BYD's EV sales in Q4 were 595,413 in contrast to Tesla's 495,570.

from https://carnewschina.com/2025/01/01/byd-sold-record-breaking...

    BYD sold a record-breaking 514,809 new energy vehicles (NEVs) in December, bringing the cumulative 2024 sales to 4,272,145 units, up 41.3% compared to 3 million in 2023. This marks the first time BYD sold over 4 million cars annually.

    Out of it, 1,764,992 were passenger BEVs (battery electric vehicles), an increase of 12% from 1.6 million in 2023. All-electric vehicles represented 41.5% of BYD’s total sales in 2024.

    BYD sold 2,485,378 passenger PHEVs (plug-in hybrid vehicles) in 2024, up 72.8% from 1.4 million in 2023. Plug-in hybrids represented 58.5% of BYD’s total sales in 2024.

Re: Tesla reports 1.1% sales drop for 2024, first annual decline in at least 9 years

#85

Post by JumpCrisscross »

avgDev wrote: post #81
light_hue_1 wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think so. At least from my personal experiences I know of at least a dozen sales that 3 years ago they would have made hands now. People compromise and buy what are clearly worse cars to avoid the Tesla brand. A friend just brought an ioniq a few months ago, same friend who was salivating over our Tesla a few years ago and kept talking about buying one endlessly. Guess why they didn't buy one.. Heck. I'm one…

I don't think Tesla can get rid of Musk. If investors saw Tesla as just a car company the stock would collapse. Musk keeps making promises and breaking them, but it seems to pump the stock thus far.

> don't think Tesla can get rid of Musk

They can't and they shouldn't. Tesla has a solid business. It just looks like it may have capped out its growth prospects in the U.S. and Europe. (In vehicles.)

Re: Tesla reports 1.1% sales drop for 2024, first annual decline in at least 9 years

#86

Post by chaps »

JumpCrisscross wrote: post #71
bko wrote: post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The upside of having an outspoken public figure at the head is that he's in charge and takes ownership. It's pretty wild that you can have some failure in your Tesla, and you can just tweet about it and if its a compelling issue you'll get the CEO to respond and address it directly. Imagine trying to get the attention of someone from Ford. I don't know if you can have it both ways. Either you're a faceless soulless c…

> I don't think him being eccentric and generally disagreeable is unrelated to him building great products and companies Within the domain of the private sector, yes. The paedo comments were distasteful, but that's about it. That changed when he became a political figure. (And a partisan one at that.) Musk, the brand, has fundamentally changed in a way that more resembles Soros or Murdoch than the bipartisan tech tit…

Your definition of "distasteful, but that's about it" is likely substantially understated from just about everyone else in the world.

Re: Tesla reports 1.1% sales drop for 2024, first annual decline in at least 9 years

#87

Post by bearjaws »

mbesto wrote: post #58

My friend said it best: "EVs are great second cars" I think we're finally hitting the saturation point of EVs as the market who adopted them is realizing their flaws as a primary vehicle: - Inadequate infrastructure (both localized "my apartment doesn't have a charging station" and more globally "I stopped at a supercharger station and it was full of people so my charge went from 100 kW to 15 kW and took 45 min to ch…

It does not go down to 15kw.

At old Tesla stations it went from 150kw to 75kw.

Any v3 station (first introduced in 2019!) will stay at 150kw to 250kw. I haven't seen a v2 station in 2 years now.

You also don't need a battery based on its age, you need it based on its mileage. Some people like my wife only drive 8k miles a year, which is more around 20 years...

Re: Tesla reports 1.1% sales drop for 2024, first annual decline in at least 9 years

#88

Post by SoftTalker »

xiphias2 wrote: post #76
SoftTalker wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think it's more simply that the market of people who want an EV and can afford a Tesla is now saturated.

BYD is continuing what Tesla started: getting cheaper while scaling up battery and car production. The market is there for worse and much cheaper electric cars, just not mainly in US.

I think some of that demand is there in the US. My daily needs for a car would be satisfied with 100 mile range, allowing for a pretty generous buffer. I also sometimes need to drive beyond the range of an EV without wanting to think about recharging delays or possibly getting stranded.

I'd consider owning a very cheap small EV for my daily needs, but not at the prices they command today. Even something like a Nissan Leaf is far too expensive for that.

Re: Tesla reports 1.1% sales drop for 2024, first annual decline in at least 9 years

#89

Post by JumpCrisscross »

camhart wrote: post #74
JumpCrisscross wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> He's only extreme if your view points are extreme left Musk's policy positions are all over the political compass. While I wouldn't call him a right-wing extremist (that's where Loomer et al live), he's certainly a right winger in the political company he keeps and supports. > Hello downvotes "Please don't comment about the voting on comments. It never does any good, and it makes boring reading" [1]. [1] https://ne…

[flagged]

> nothing wrong with being a right winger, unless you live in a silo that is intolerant to it

No, but it's obviously going to alienate a large swath of the consumer base, i.e. most people able to and interested in buying an electric car.

> Commenting on downvotes is done to try and get people to second guess their knee jerk reaction

It's the only reason I flagged your comment.

Also, really? Do you think a speech is stronger if it ends with "obviously everyone in this room is going to disagree with me"?

Re: Tesla reports 1.1% sales drop for 2024, first annual decline in at least 9 years

#90

Post by lelandbatey »

sidcool wrote: post #4

Why's there so much hate for Tesla here on HN?

All it took for me was renting their vehicle to drive and finding that the controls for everything we're terrible, just awful to use while trying to operate a vehicle. Turning on the windshield wipers? Gotta fill out your taxes on the touch screen. Changing the direction of the AC? Don't look at the road, look at our "fancy animated widget for changing which way the air blows". It was shockingly poorly thought out and a total bandaid over them cheaping out just having buttons for things you'll do every time you drive.

Driving their cars is what made me hate their cars.

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