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Microsoft is introducing hidden APIs to VS Code only enabled for Copilot?

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Re: Microsoft is introducing hidden APIs to VS Code only enabled for Copilot?

#81

Post by tristan957 »

swiftcoder wrote: post #65
fortenforge wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Eh not quite. Famously, you can fork VSCode, but you can't use the VSCode Extension Marketplace if you do, which loses a lot of the network effect benefits of the VSCode ecosystem. (As far as I know Cursor is flat out violating Microsoft's terms of service with respect to the extension marketplace).

I believe this also blocks you from using Microsoft's proprietary language extensions, and they have been steadily switching the default language packages from OSS to proprietary.

Yes. You famously cannot use the C/C++ language server bundled in the C/C++ extension or Pylance. Who knows what other development tools they will lock behind their fork to the detriment of open source communities. Also you can't use their Remote Extension suite.

Re: Microsoft is introducing hidden APIs to VS Code only enabled for Copilot?

#82

Post by Jcampuzano2 »

I really don't get why people are mad about this. I get it, people don't like MS but theres really no surprises here, nor is it really all that bad. They put time, effort and money into developing VSCode. Its open source so if you want to use these API's you can in a forked version. And of course if you're developing something thats free for everyone to use, and its not forcing you to use it, I don't see an issue with using private API's.

And while some make the alegory to IE its not the same since its not pre-installed on every machine, nor are they forcing you to use it. So while yes they have a lot of market share, they have nothing stopping you from forking it yourself or just using a different editor.

Re: Microsoft is introducing hidden APIs to VS Code only enabled for Copilot?

#84

Post by hu3 »

peeters wrote: post #80
frenchie4111 wrote: post #13

Everyone is reading this as intentional anti-competitive practices. While that may be true, isn't another reasonable explanation that the Copilot development team is moving as fast as they can and these sorts of workarounds are being forced through in the name of team velocity? It takes a lot more time/energy to push public APIs and it's probably a very different team than the team developing the copilot extension. S…

> Everyone is reading this as intentional anti-competitive practices. While that may be true, isn't another reasonable explanation that the Copilot development team is moving as fast as they can and these sorts of workarounds are being forced through in the name of team velocity? Wouldn't another way of saying that be "the Copilot development team is leveraging their Microsoft ownership to create products in a way no…

I agree. Apple has been doing this for years as well.

Re: Microsoft is introducing hidden APIs to VS Code only enabled for Copilot?

#85

Post by dartos »

fragmede wrote: post #46
dartos wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

People on HN seem to be either very anti-corporatist or love to white knight big tech There’s no in between.

the inbetweeners who are here aren't motivated to post about being in-between, which is why it reads that way, unfortunately.

The classic internet engagement bias.

Re: Microsoft is introducing hidden APIs to VS Code only enabled for Copilot?

#86

Post by Arainach »

frenchie4111 wrote: post #13

Everyone is reading this as intentional anti-competitive practices. While that may be true, isn't another reasonable explanation that the Copilot development team is moving as fast as they can and these sorts of workarounds are being forced through in the name of team velocity? It takes a lot more time/energy to push public APIs and it's probably a very different team than the team developing the copilot extension. S…

Disclaimer: I used to work at Microsoft. These days I work at a competitor. All words my own and represent neither entity.

Microsoft has the culture and the technology to tell private and public APIs apart and to check code across the company to ensure that only public APIs are called. This was required for decades as part of the Department of Justice consent decree and every single product in the company had scanners to check that they weren't using any private APIs (or similar hacks to get access to them such as privately searching for symbols in Windows DLL files). This was drilled into the heads of everyone, including what I assume are 90% of VP+ people currently at the company, for a very long time.

For them to do this is a conscious decision to be anticompetitive.

Re: Microsoft is introducing hidden APIs to VS Code only enabled for Copilot?

#88

Post by dartos »

boredtofears wrote: post #49
hggigg wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There was that bit a few years back where the HN folk saw Satya as the second coming of Microsoft and anything even slightly critical or suspicious of Microsoft was downvoted to oblivion as highly implausible. I think people are still coming down from that high. He's not the messiah, he's a naughty businessman! (Note: I shot my HN account then because the majority of the MS stuff on here was utterly intolerable for m…

It’s possible to be both critical of Microsoft’s past and also pleased at their last decade of efforts in OSS with things like vscode and typescript.

It’s possible to do both of those and still not trust MS.

I don’t believe that vscode will be this free mostly open editor forever. I’m expecting to see vscode pro or something any day.

Typescript can, very cynically, be seen as an on-ramp for vscode, as vscode has pretty much the best typescript suppor.

Re: Microsoft is introducing hidden APIs to VS Code only enabled for Copilot?

#89

Post by immibis »

tristan957 wrote: post #47
rty32 wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Exactly. That's what Cursor did, and (I think) Microsoft will agree with that and maybe even welcome developers to do this.

Has Microsoft allowed Cursor to access the VSCode Marketplace? As far as I know, it is against the ToS for any editor other than VSCode to access it.

Fortunately most ToS are not legally enforceable, but only amount to a public statement of "we are threatening to block your IP if you do this"

Re: Microsoft is introducing hidden APIs to VS Code only enabled for Copilot?

#90

Post by rcarmo »

isatty wrote: post #83
sub7 wrote: post #15

I had to block all network traffic from VSCode that shit is spyware out of the box. Maybe the vi crew is actually onto something.

vi/emacs crew was never wrong. Imagine willingly using a Microsoft product.

I started with emacs back in the VT220 days (we didn't have tmux/screen in VAXen, nor in Ultrix, and the mail reader was great), moved to vim in the Slackware years, and now switch between VS Code and nvim on my Mac without any qualms. Sometimes I even run nvim inside the VS Code terminal for quick edits.
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