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How We Found Bin Laden: The Basics of Foreign Signals Intelligence

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Re: How We Found Bin Laden: The Basics of Foreign Signals Intelligence

#81

Post by acoard »

netsharc wrote: post #66

On minute 38 out of 48 (listening on 2x speed), and so far there's nothing worth hearing in here.. the first 18 minutes is one of them explaining what a signal is and how the NSA keeps the world safe and follows the law, then another one of them talks in general about, yeah someone got a signal and it lead to Bin Laden. How? No further details... Edit to add: The last 10 minutes have the guest talking about the day o…

> Unsaid is of course that the USA accused, found guilty, and executed someone without trial, where evidence is shown of their guilt. Sure on balance I think Bin Laden is responsible for 9/11, but I think the source for this belief is the US government.

The United States declared war on Al-Qaeda, and killed it's leader in response to an attack on 9/11 that leader claimed credit for. Domestic courts don't factor in here. Any country is lawfully allowed to kill enemy combatants or military leadership in a war.

Re: How We Found Bin Laden: The Basics of Foreign Signals Intelligence

#84

Post by olliej »

acoard wrote: post #81
netsharc wrote: post #66

On minute 38 out of 48 (listening on 2x speed), and so far there's nothing worth hearing in here.. the first 18 minutes is one of them explaining what a signal is and how the NSA keeps the world safe and follows the law, then another one of them talks in general about, yeah someone got a signal and it lead to Bin Laden. How? No further details... Edit to add: The last 10 minutes have the guest talking about the day o…

> Unsaid is of course that the USA accused, found guilty, and executed someone without trial, where evidence is shown of their guilt. Sure on balance I think Bin Laden is responsible for 9/11, but I think the source for this belief is the US government. The United States declared war on Al-Qaeda, and killed it's leader in response to an attack on 9/11 that leader claimed credit for. Domestic courts don't factor in he…

So if someone killed or funded a bombing in the UK, the UK would be permitted to send a secret group to the US to execute them without a trial? (Just confirming your position here that executing people who fund terrorism without a trial - the thing that proves they were responsible, and recall a lot of Americans funded the IRA)

Re: How We Found Bin Laden: The Basics of Foreign Signals Intelligence

#85

Post by dgfitz »

pas wrote: post #72
dgfitz wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> From the NSA, this seems like historical revisionism as it contradicts the bin Laden story widely accepted. You just described counterintelligence propaganda.

Sorry can you elaborate on this? What part is propaganda?

I’d basically quote your whole post. You said that NSA contradicted a widely accepted story. Where did that story come from?

Re: How We Found Bin Laden: The Basics of Foreign Signals Intelligence

#86

Post by aguaviva »

jmyeet wrote: post #17
dataflow wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The short version is: 9/11 happens. The Taliban offer to hand over bin Laden and George W. Bush refuses [1] I looked at your link. It seems you missed a huge asterisk on that from your own article: > the third most powerful figure in the ruling Taliban regime told reporters that the Taliban would require evidence that Bin Laden was behind the September 11 terrorist attacks in the US

So how did the alternative course of action work out? EDIT: instead of rejecting the Taliban's offer outright and, say, negotiating and acceptable outcome, we chose to go to war, spend trillions of dollars, kill countless people and ultimately still leave the Taliban in power. The Taliban saying they need proof is a negotiation. There is no court of law. We could've simply bribed them. Imagine how much cheaper and ho…

Irony of ironies, it was our material support to Afghanistan in the Soviet invasion that quite literally created bin Laden.

Irony of ironies, this is actually a deeply Western-centric point of view which assumes that everything that happens in the world does so as a result of actions performed by its own hand -- and that the people in affected countries have no agency, goals or vision of their own.

Re: How We Found Bin Laden: The Basics of Foreign Signals Intelligence

#87

Post by aguaviva »

jmyeet wrote: post #19
khuey wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The Taliban offer to hand over bin Laden and George W. Bush refuses A bit disingenuous to say that and leave out that the most generous version of that offer was to hand Bin Laden over to a third country .

So what's the goal here? To exact vengeance on one individual? To remove his ability to further act in this capacity? Because what we chose instead was to spend $8 trillion on a 20 year war killing millions in Iraq and Afghanistan and still to objectively lose militarily, politically and in terms of the ability for the US to project power in the region. The Taliban control Afghanistan once again. All while doing abso…

20 year war killing millions in Iraq and Afghanistan

Are you sure about the "millions" part? In you know, the factual sense?

Or does it just feel like something neat to say, to get your point across?

Re: How We Found Bin Laden: The Basics of Foreign Signals Intelligence

#88

Post by JetSpiegel »

roger10-4 wrote: post #47
dgfitz wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To expand on this, NSA is located on Ft. George Mead, in the state of Maryland. I have no doubt (as in, this is true) they have locations all over the world.

Oahu, Hawaii is another notable location. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hawaii_Cryptologic_Center

Just make sure not to fly to Hong Kong from there.

Re: How We Found Bin Laden: The Basics of Foreign Signals Intelligence

#89

Post by JetSpiegel »

aguaviva wrote: post #87
jmyeet wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So what's the goal here? To exact vengeance on one individual? To remove his ability to further act in this capacity? Because what we chose instead was to spend $8 trillion on a 20 year war killing millions in Iraq and Afghanistan and still to objectively lose militarily, politically and in terms of the ability for the US to project power in the region. The Taliban control Afghanistan once again. All while doing abso…

20 year war killing millions in Iraq and Afghanistan Are you sure about the "millions" part? In you know, the factual sense? Or does it just feel like something neat to say, to get your point across?

Do you doubt that a million iraquis died in the war that lasted almost a decade? How many people died in Ukraine or Gaza in a couple years?
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