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Meta AI: "The Future of AI Is Open Source and Decentralized"

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Re: Meta AI: "The Future of AI Is Open Source and Decentralized"

#81

Post by gyomu »

bee_rider wrote: post #35
rkou wrote: post #21

And what about the future of social media? This is such devious, but increasingly obvious, narrative crafting by a commercial entity that has proven itself adversarial to an open and decentralized internet / ideas and knowledge economy. The argument goes as follows: - The future of AI is open source and decentralized - We want to win the future of AI instead, become a central leader and player in the collective open-…

> Read the terms of use / contract for Meta AI products. If you deploy it, some producer finds the model spits out copyrighted content, knocks on Meta's door, Meta will point to you for the rest of the court case. If that's the future for AI, then it doesn't really matter whether China wins. As much as I hate Facebook, I think that seems pretty… reasonable? These AI tools are just tools. If somebody uses a crayon to…

This is a bad analogy. The factory producing crayons doesn’t need to ingest hundreds of millions of copyrighted works as a fundamental part of its process to make crayons.

Re: Meta AI: "The Future of AI Is Open Source and Decentralized"

#82

Post by Manuel_D »

dzonga wrote: post #27

the reason - i'm a little bearish on AI is due to its cost. small companies won't innovate on models if they don't have billions to burn to train the models. yet when you look back at history, things that were revolutionary, it was due to low cost of production. web, bicycles, cars, steam engine cars etc.

I suspect that models will become smaller, getting pruned to focus on relevant tasks. Someone using an LLM to power tech support chat doesn't want, nor need, the ability to generate random short stories. In this sense, AI is akin to cars prior to assembly line manufacturing: expensive and bespoke machines, with their full potential tapped when they're later made in a more efficient manner.

Re: Meta AI: "The Future of AI Is Open Source and Decentralized"

#83

Post by cornholio »

rkou wrote: post #39
bee_rider wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Read the terms of use / contract for Meta AI products. If you deploy it, some producer finds the model spits out copyrighted content, knocks on Meta's door, Meta will point to you for the rest of the court case. If that's the future for AI, then it doesn't really matter whether China wins. As much as I hate Facebook, I think that seems pretty… reasonable? These AI tools are just tools. If somebody uses a crayon to…

AI safety is expensive, or even impossible, by releasing your models for local inference (not behind API). Meta AI shifts the responsibility of highly-general highly-capable AI models to smaller developers, putting ethics, safety, legal, and guard-rails responsibility on innovators who want to innovate with AI (without having the knowledge or resources to do so by themselves) as an "open-source" hacking project. Whil…

This strange obsession with synthetic CSAM as the absolute epitome of "AI safety" says more about the collective phobias and sensibilities of our society than about any objective "safety" issues.

Of course, from a PR perspective, it would be extremely "unsafe" for a publicly traded company to release a tool that can spew out pedophile literature, to the point of being an existential threat. Twitter was economically cancelled for much less. But as far as dangerous AI goes, it's one of the most benign and inconsequential failure modes.

Re: Meta AI: "The Future of AI Is Open Source and Decentralized"

#84

Post by tacocataco »

Calvin02 wrote: post #34
rkou wrote: post #21

And what about the future of social media? This is such devious, but increasingly obvious, narrative crafting by a commercial entity that has proven itself adversarial to an open and decentralized internet / ideas and knowledge economy. The argument goes as follows: - The future of AI is open source and decentralized - We want to win the future of AI instead, become a central leader and player in the collective open-…

Doesn’t Threads and Fediverse indicate that they are headed that way for social as well?

Last I checked, there was a movement in the biggest instances to defederate from meta's embrace stage of "embrace extend extinguish" playbook. I didn't check back to see if it got pushed through.

Given the nature of the fediverse, if it happened or not depends on the instance you use/follow.

Re: Meta AI: "The Future of AI Is Open Source and Decentralized"

#85

Post by fullshark »

VeejayRampay wrote: post #50
hyuuu wrote: post #16

the view of the comments here seems to be quite negative for what meta is doing. Honest question, should they go to the route of openai and closed source + paid access instead? OpenAI or Claude seem to garner more positive views than llama open sourced.

people are just way too invested in the OpenAI hype and they don't want people threatening that in any way

Nah they are just calling out shameless corporate bullshit. OpenAI were bullshitters too re: promoting open source, but they are not even pretending anymore and once they change their governance structure the idea that they were ever promoting open source will be merely an amusing memory.

Re: Meta AI: "The Future of AI Is Open Source and Decentralized"

#86

Post by jongjong »

rkou wrote: post #21

And what about the future of social media? This is such devious, but increasingly obvious, narrative crafting by a commercial entity that has proven itself adversarial to an open and decentralized internet / ideas and knowledge economy. The argument goes as follows: - The future of AI is open source and decentralized - We want to win the future of AI instead, become a central leader and player in the collective open-…

Maybe the road to heaven is paved with bad intentions.

Re: Meta AI: "The Future of AI Is Open Source and Decentralized"

#87

Post by bee_rider »

gyomu wrote: post #81
bee_rider wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Read the terms of use / contract for Meta AI products. If you deploy it, some producer finds the model spits out copyrighted content, knocks on Meta's door, Meta will point to you for the rest of the court case. If that's the future for AI, then it doesn't really matter whether China wins. As much as I hate Facebook, I think that seems pretty… reasonable? These AI tools are just tools. If somebody uses a crayon to…

This is a bad analogy. The factory producing crayons doesn’t need to ingest hundreds of millions of copyrighted works as a fundamental part of its process to make crayons.

I don’t think it is a bad analogy, it is just separating out the issues.

If the thing required breaking the law to make, it just shouldn’t have been made. But, in that case, Facebook should not accept liability for how their users use the thing. They should just not share it at all, and delete it.

Re: Meta AI: "The Future of AI Is Open Source and Decentralized"

#88

Post by tomjen3 »

foobar_______ wrote: post #31
rkou wrote: post #21

And what about the future of social media? This is such devious, but increasingly obvious, narrative crafting by a commercial entity that has proven itself adversarial to an open and decentralized internet / ideas and knowledge economy. The argument goes as follows: - The future of AI is open source and decentralized - We want to win the future of AI instead, become a central leader and player in the collective open-…

It has been clear from the beginning that Meta's supposed desire for an open source AI, is just a coping mechanism for the fact that got beat out of the gate. This is an attempt to commoditize AI and reduce OpenAI/Google/Whoever's advantage. It is effective, not doubt, but all this wankery about how noble they are for creating an open-source AI future is just bullshit.

It’s because Facebooks complementary good is content (primary good is ad slots) and if somebody wins the ai race they can pump out enough content to jumpstart a Facebook competitor with a ton of content.

Re: Meta AI: "The Future of AI Is Open Source and Decentralized"

#89

Post by dartos »

bee_rider wrote: post #87
gyomu wrote: post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is a bad analogy. The factory producing crayons doesn’t need to ingest hundreds of millions of copyrighted works as a fundamental part of its process to make crayons.

I don’t think it is a bad analogy, it is just separating out the issues. If the thing required breaking the law to make, it just shouldn’t have been made. But, in that case, Facebook should not accept liability for how their users use the thing. They should just not share it at all, and delete it.

Crayons aren’t made by mashing people’s artwork through a gpu.

Crayons don’t generate content either.

If I download something from megaupload (rip) megaupload is the one that gets in trouble. They are storing, compressing, and shipping that information to me.

The same thing happens with AI, the information is just encoded in the model weights instead of a video or text encoding or whatever. When you download a model, you’re downloading a lossy compressed version of all the data it was trained on.

Re: Meta AI: "The Future of AI Is Open Source and Decentralized"

#90

Post by amy-petrik-214 »

rkou wrote: post #21

And what about the future of social media? This is such devious, but increasingly obvious, narrative crafting by a commercial entity that has proven itself adversarial to an open and decentralized internet / ideas and knowledge economy. The argument goes as follows: - The future of AI is open source and decentralized - We want to win the future of AI instead, become a central leader and player in the collective open-…

It's got nothing to do with Meta's social media business directly. Massive as the FB dataset is, it gets mogged by google who, what with their advanced non-PHP-based infra and superior coders, basically have way more and way better and way more accessible data... and their own AI CPUs they made, and a bigger cluster, and faster software, and more store, and so on. Big picture, Google is poised to steamroll Facebook AI-wise, and if no them, then openAI+microsoft

So Meta says "well we will buy tons of compute and try to make it distributed" "we'll make the model open and people will fine-tune with data that they found" and so on. Now google and openAI aren't competing versus meta, they are competing versus meta + all compute owned by amateurs + all data scrapped by all amateurs, which is non-trivial. so it's not so much as aspiring to be #1 as capping the knees of the competition who has superior competitiveness - but people love it because the common man wins here for once.

Anyway, eventually, they'll all be open models. Near future weaker models will run on a PC, bigger models on the cluster, weakest models on the phone... then just weak models on the phone and bigger on the PC.. eventually anything and everything fits on a phone and maybe iWatch. Even Google and openAI will have to run on the PC/phone at this point, it wouldn't make sense not to. Then since people have local access to these devices, it all gets reverse engineered, boom boom boom. now they're all open

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