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How Waymo outlasted the competition and made robo-taxis a real business

fortune.com

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Re: How Waymo outlasted the competition and made robo-taxis a real business

#81

Post by charlie0 »

codexb wrote: post #55
jseliger wrote: post #3

I just left a version of this in another thread—I live in Phoenix and now take Waymo regularly, and it seems like we're close to a world in which most people take self-driving cars most of the time, crash rates plummet, and these kinds of articles come to resemble articles from 1910 about horse-related problems. Humans suck at driving: https://jakeseliger.com/2019/12/16/maybe-cars-are-just-reall... Waymos avoid many…

Maybe if you're under 25 and have always lived in a dense city this seems like a valid take. Taxis aren't new, they have always existed. Just because they're driven by computers now isn't going to magically change all the reasons that people didn't use them before (hint: it wasn't because they were driven by humans). No one with kids wants to ride in taxis with kids all the time. Ditto for anyone with hobbies that re…

This will boil down to availability and price. Taxis are generally just too expensive to use often and also waits are too long. Of course, I'm comparing cost of frequent taxis vs buying a used car.

Re: How Waymo outlasted the competition and made robo-taxis a real business

#82

Post by ein0p »

fragmede wrote: post #78
ein0p wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Exactly. And there’s no dude there to prevent it.

A human driver's not going to stop a gang of hooligans from throwing a Molotov their way.

But they would. For one thing, a human would just drive away. For another, a mob would have no reason to attack a broke-ass taxi driver, while they have every moral justification to attack a $3T gigacorp built on surveillance capitalism.

Re: How Waymo outlasted the competition and made robo-taxis a real business

#83

Post by dventimi »

codetrotter wrote: post #76
spiderice wrote: post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have kids and don't like Taxis, but I'm not sure I entirely agree with your take. The idea of a humanless Taxi showing up to my house sounds way more appealing to me. I can take my time to get car seats in and kids buckled, without feeling the pressure to hurry from the human driver. I don't have to feel like my kids misbehaving are going to annoy a human driver, or get me a bad review in Uber/Lyft. I don't have to…

> I don't have to worry about tipping I can almost guarantee that if they don’t already, the robo-taxis will eventually start asking for tips. This is already the case at self-checkout in some stores for example. As long as the companies can get away with it, they will tack on any number of extra fees and charges even if those fees and charges really don’t make any sense. Hell, even tipping people does not really mak…

I do not accept your guarantee.

Re: How Waymo outlasted the competition and made robo-taxis a real business

#84

Post by seanmcdirmid »

codexb wrote: post #55
jseliger wrote: post #3

I just left a version of this in another thread—I live in Phoenix and now take Waymo regularly, and it seems like we're close to a world in which most people take self-driving cars most of the time, crash rates plummet, and these kinds of articles come to resemble articles from 1910 about horse-related problems. Humans suck at driving: https://jakeseliger.com/2019/12/16/maybe-cars-are-just-reall... Waymos avoid many…

Maybe if you're under 25 and have always lived in a dense city this seems like a valid take. Taxis aren't new, they have always existed. Just because they're driven by computers now isn't going to magically change all the reasons that people didn't use them before (hint: it wasn't because they were driven by humans). No one with kids wants to ride in taxis with kids all the time. Ditto for anyone with hobbies that re…

I used to live in China where taxi usage was much more ubiquitous, and…you really live to live in a world where you aren’t expected to live in a car, be it with public transit (Europe, Japan) or public transit + lots of taxis (China) or tuktuks or whatever. But yes, your hobbies tend to be different and adapted, bikes, for example, get you places, and are not taken places, or you get them on the train which actually hits the trail head you want to use. You rent the kayak on site, and there is always a place to do that because lots of other people are in the same car-less boat as you are.

You mention American at the end of your comment, but the rest of the world isn’t the same. Waymo doesn’t really have to limit itself to the states once they get the concept worked out.

Re: How Waymo outlasted the competition and made robo-taxis a real business

#85

Post by desert_rue »

renegade-otter wrote: post #39

New York City is not going to see robo taxis for a very, very long time. We are just now catching up to the rest of the cities in terms of how garbage is collected, after about a hundred years.

Plus subway bits that are from the 1930s

Re: How Waymo outlasted the competition and made robo-taxis a real business

#86

Post by seanmcdirmid »

okdood64 wrote: post #18
titanomachy wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In the same vein, I don't ride uber often but when I do I often find that drivers leave their windows closed and car's air circulation turned off completely. When I ask for "a bit of airflow" they apparently hear it as "I'm too hot", so they turn AC to maximum power. I'm not sure whether this reflects their own preferences, what they think customers want, or if they are just completely oblivious.

I have never had trouble cracking open the window on my own. Do you not try?

The child safety disable is often turned on for backseat windows.

Re: How Waymo outlasted the competition and made robo-taxis a real business

#87

Post by baron816 »

vincnetas wrote: post #79

As a proponent of good public transportation I'm a bit afraid that automated taxis will get big enough in USA that they will start influence city wide decisions on how to develop city transport network even in Europe when time comes for them to expand their business.

I'm sorry but good public transit in the US isn't going to happen. Passenger rail has never been profitable anywhere since its very inception. With the rise of remote work, and declining ratios of working-age populations putting increasing pressure on public finances, we're just never going to see a widespread expansion of public transit.

AVs give us a path toward a world where very few people need to own their own car. We can put all those parking spaces to better use. We can improve equity by giving more people access to safe, reliable, affordable, and convenient point-to-point transportation. Being able to consistently get a ride to where you need to go is something we consistently under-appreciate. It means being able to get a better paying job on the other side of town. Or not having to worry about missing a dialysis appointment, or a meeting with your parole officer or therapist. When the marginal cost of a robotaxi/robobus ride is close to zero is when the AI economic boom will really begin.

Re: How Waymo outlasted the competition and made robo-taxis a real business

#88

Post by seanmcdirmid »

robotnikman wrote: post #9
xvedejas wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They're the present here in SF, driving every day and more safely than the humans do. And as a human driver, I can testify that these streets are not particularly easy to drive on.

They are here in the Phoenix area too and I have not seen and issues with them. However, we are blessed by sunny weather 99% of the time. I think the biggest challenges will be having them drive in adverse weather conditions present throughout the rest of the country, such as blizzards, hail, torrential rain, dense fog.

You know, that’s a challenge for human drivers as well. Try getting an Uber during those weather events, their might be one or two running crazily to get super surge pricing when there are usually a few hundred.

Re: How Waymo outlasted the competition and made robo-taxis a real business

#89

Post by hossbeast »

fragmede wrote: post #80
jseliger wrote: post #3

I just left a version of this in another thread—I live in Phoenix and now take Waymo regularly, and it seems like we're close to a world in which most people take self-driving cars most of the time, crash rates plummet, and these kinds of articles come to resemble articles from 1910 about horse-related problems. Humans suck at driving: https://jakeseliger.com/2019/12/16/maybe-cars-are-just-reall... Waymos avoid many…

After two of my (women) friends were assaulted by Uber/Lyft drivers, a weird smell is the least of my fears. If I'm sending someone on a ride late a night, Waymo's lack of driver is a huge reason to prefer them over Uber/Lyft. But only if the destination is in a safe neighborhood. A human driver's going to be able to make a better assessment of if it's safe to let someone off somewhere, vs Waymos will randomly drop y…

It is also that they suck on average.

Re: How Waymo outlasted the competition and made robo-taxis a real business

#90

Post by bigfudge »

codexb wrote: post #55
jseliger wrote: post #3

I just left a version of this in another thread—I live in Phoenix and now take Waymo regularly, and it seems like we're close to a world in which most people take self-driving cars most of the time, crash rates plummet, and these kinds of articles come to resemble articles from 1910 about horse-related problems. Humans suck at driving: https://jakeseliger.com/2019/12/16/maybe-cars-are-just-reall... Waymos avoid many…

Maybe if you're under 25 and have always lived in a dense city this seems like a valid take. Taxis aren't new, they have always existed. Just because they're driven by computers now isn't going to magically change all the reasons that people didn't use them before (hint: it wasn't because they were driven by humans). No one with kids wants to ride in taxis with kids all the time. Ditto for anyone with hobbies that re…

I think you’re wrong about most of the scenarios on your list. And once the market is mature, I can imagine it would be great to be picked up in a minivan after a days cycling somewhere new and not on a loop route.

Americans have become emotionally attached to cars because of what they enable them to do. That might take a while to die. But in Europe cars are more of a pita to own and run because we have less space. I don’t have any great love for mine. As soon as waymo gets here and is reasonably priced I’ll get rid of my car.

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