This is absolutely glorious. Days after forcing it's users into mandatory arbitrations this comes out. Would be awesome if holding someone's TV hostage until they agree to not sue you was illegal.
[deleted]
Roku data breach: Over 15k accounts affected
81–90 of 95 posts
Re: Roku data breach: Over 15k accounts affected
#82Earlier quoted context omitted.
If enough people do it, forced arbitration can actually end up being expensive for the company. iIRC, there was a case where the company itself tried to get out of the forced arbitration and go to court since it was a pain to try to handle a massive number of individual arbitration cases. I wonder how Roku would react if every Roku user filed an arbitration case since your data was at risk.
The Roku lawyers seem to be defending specifically against this. The new terms have language that say that if enough people enter arbitration at the same time, they have to do one big "mass arbitration."
Wow so they will tell an entire group of people to pound sand at the same time. Neat
Re: Roku data breach: Over 15k accounts affected
#83For those who don't know, just a week or so ago Roku amended the arbitration clause of their terms of service and soft-bricked every Roku in the US until you Agreed to the new terms. This even extended to TVs from other brands with Roku software, making the TV non-functional even as a dumb display since the Roku software controls input selection AND would ignore any HDMI-CEC commands. I guess we know why now. There i…
Surely it’s just a happy coincidence that Roku hamfistedly decided to force all customers into arbitration before disclosing a breach…
Re: Roku data breach: Over 15k accounts affected
#84Looks like Ars Technica called it: Roku is also taking heat for using forced arbitration at all, which some argue can have one-sided benefits. In a similar move in December, for example, 23andMe said users had 30 days to opt out of its new dispute resolution terms, which included mass arbitration rules (the genetics firm let customers opt out via email, though). The changes came after 23andMe user data was stolen in…
If enough people do it, forced arbitration can actually end up being expensive for the company. iIRC, there was a case where the company itself tried to get out of the forced arbitration and go to court since it was a pain to try to handle a massive number of individual arbitration cases. I wonder how Roku would react if every Roku user filed an arbitration case since your data was at risk.
> iIRC, there was a case where the company itself tried to get out of the forced arbitration and go to court since it was a pain to try to handle a massive number of individual arbitration cases.
Twitter, in relation to arbitration with employees it terminated? https://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2023/07/twitter-refuses-...
Re: Roku data breach: Over 15k accounts affected
#85Earlier quoted context omitted.
If enough people do it, forced arbitration can actually end up being expensive for the company. iIRC, there was a case where the company itself tried to get out of the forced arbitration and go to court since it was a pain to try to handle a massive number of individual arbitration cases. I wonder how Roku would react if every Roku user filed an arbitration case since your data was at risk.
> iIRC, there was a case where the company itself tried to get out of the forced arbitration and go to court since it was a pain to try to handle a massive number of individual arbitration cases. Twitter, in relation to arbitration with employees it terminated? https://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2023/07/twitter-refuses-...
I remember this happening with Inuit in 2020
> Judge Breyer suggested at the Dec. 17 hearing on the proposed class action settlement that Intuit has only itself to blame for its mass arbitration predicament. “You knew what the rules of arbitration were. You knew all these things. And you elected - you elected to go to arbitration. And you fought fairly, vigorously, and it turns out correctly, that you had this right to insist on arbitration,” the judge told Intuit counsel Rodger Cole of Fenwick & West. “Now you come in, when you see how it is unfolding, and say: ‘Not so fast … Now we want to turn and do something else.’”
https://www.reuters.com/article/legal-us-otc-intuit/judge-br...
Re: Roku data breach: Over 15k accounts affected
#86For those who don't know, just a week or so ago Roku amended the arbitration clause of their terms of service and soft-bricked every Roku in the US until you Agreed to the new terms. This even extended to TVs from other brands with Roku software, making the TV non-functional even as a dumb display since the Roku software controls input selection AND would ignore any HDMI-CEC commands. I guess we know why now. There i…
These lawyers who come up with these schemes never seem to consider capacity planning.
Forced arbitration? Much better than an expensive lawsuit.
Except when hundreds to thousands of people want arbitration and since the company wanted arbitration, we have to foot the bill... Yikes.
Hmmm. Fix the arbitration scaling problem by changing to forced mass arbitration. But the users will have to send in a letter to opt out of the new agreement.
Roku has 80 million+ accounts.
What happens when even one percent of those account opt out? Put on your "grudgingly-pay-the-outrageous-fine-with-pennies" hat and I'm sure you can come up with ways to increase the difficulty level of receiving many letters opting out of this new agreement.
Re: Roku data breach: Over 15k accounts affected
#87Earlier quoted context omitted.
I don't know what you mean by "fact", but your vote certainly holds less proportional power to influence a politician than that of 1/(population of the us). Politicians straight-up don't care about your opinion unless you can show up as a meaningful horde, and judging by the reaction to the Israeli invasion of Palestine that doesn't hold much water either.
I literally said that other interests hold outsized power. Not sure what your goal is here.
I guess I read your comment as contradicting itself by the phrase "the power" rather than "the illusion of power", especially since the american public is so easily distracted by petty squabbling, whereas capital is emphatically not easily distracted but extremely focused on what it wants.
Anyway, I don't mean to start an argument over the power of voting, illusory or no. We all have opinions about the value of voting that we hold rather tightly given so much emphasis is placed on it as the center of the political power we do hold.
Re: Roku data breach: Over 15k accounts affected
#88That recent push by Roku for accepting updated EULA around arbitration makes quite a lot more sense
Re: Roku data breach: Over 15k accounts affected
#89This is absolutely glorious. Days after forcing it's users into mandatory arbitrations this comes out. Would be awesome if holding someone's TV hostage until they agree to not sue you was illegal.
I hope some regulators ask for proof that the breach was “after” and not “the cause of”. It would not shock me to learn that this was the same playbook 23andme used.
Looking at the state of things I doubt it would make a difference. Roku might pay a nominal fine at most.
Re: Roku data breach: Over 15k accounts affected
#90Earlier quoted context omitted.
My Roku-enabled TV used to bootloop whenever I blocked it from fetching screensaver ads. Support was happy to help. First step: (re)connect to the internet. Second step: disable any network ad blocking. Hmmmmm. People rolled their eyes when I suggested that this was intentional, but these recent revelations strongly suggest that Roku is very comfortable exploiting the hell out of dark patterns. If we don't enact stro…
In the "old days," the junkbuster proxy used to return a 128x32(?) blank gif in lieu of an actual block because the page layout would :fu: if the ad wasn't in place and correctly sized. I could easily imagine that might help your situation, too Don't misunderstand me: it's 100% atrocious that any device bootloops if some ad network 403s, but on the spectrum of "spit into one hand..." and nginx in the other ...
Haha, yes, that would be something to try, but in the meantime I upgraded monitors and the new one does not have Roku or any of Roku's problems. Yet. If Roku gets away with it this will be everywhere.