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Should toggle button show its current state or the state to which it'll change? (2010)

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Re: Should toggle button show its current state or the state to which it'll change? (2010)

#81
post #71

I'm surprised we are still iterating on ideas like this, to be honest. Seems flight decks have been rather successful on complicated dashboards for a long time. Same with boats. Why can we take approximately no lessons from them?

The interfaces you are talking about require years of training, study and passing multiple tests to demonstrate proficiency. In software UX we are talking about discoverability and approachability for the untrained operator.

Re: Should toggle button show its current state or the state to which it'll change? (2010)

#82
post #45

The absolute worst example of this I have seen is the Tesla dashboard screen UI. It shows a car with labels on it, not buttons, that say "Open". That unambiguously means that the particular part is open. But that's not what it means. The labels are in fact buttons to open the parts, and you have no way of knowing.

Can someone make a car which has none of the complicated stuff? List of features I want: - automatic transmission (if ICE) - bluetooth and FM radio - no self steering - cruise control with "follow speed" - not-batshit-insane self-brake-system (use whatever Volvo uses, it works!) - good airbags and decent structural integrity - classic sedan height

No, you can't get a car with exactly the feature set you specifically want and nothing more. This is because other people want a different feature set. It's even true of things that are vastly less expensive to produce than a car.

Re: Should toggle button show its current state or the state to which it'll change? (2010)

#83
For an interface with hover interaction, a toggle button should show its current state by default and then on hover show the state it will switch to. This design pattern affords discoverability through safe interaction with the element.

Unfortunately that design pattern fails for touch interfaces, which increasingly are our primary method of interaction.

Re: Should toggle button show its current state or the state to which it'll change? (2010)

#84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I can’t find it but one of my favourite designs was a switch with a “light” beside it that lit up when the state was “on.” So when I revisit that page after a long time and see that the light is lit, does it mean that the state is currently ON or does it mean that the state will change to ON when I click it? How can I tell this by instantly looking at the lit light?

We should go back to checkboxes. The problem here is having the text change and be too clever. [x] Mute [ ] Mute "Oh the X means it's muted" Windows 95 and probably an older Mac had it all figured out.

"Mute [x]" means that 'mute is false', so I click to make it say "Mute []" but instead you take the "x" away, ... so is mute no longer false?? If sound isn't working then this can be difficult to determine. You can fix it with a tooltip and/or familiarity with the system.

Buttons have more affordance too.

Re: Should toggle button show its current state or the state to which it'll change? (2010)

#85

I have some old NASA push button switches that have two bulbs in them. When the switch is off both lights are off, when you click the switch the yellow bulb comes on and lights up the switch, and when the device you turned on actually turns on a green light turns on ( and the yellow turns off ). The idea is you push the button and the yellow state is the confirmation that you toggled the switch, but the green is the…

I like it. Why doesn't our "industry" look at aviation/military more often where miscommunication gets people killed.

Re: Should toggle button show its current state or the state to which it'll change? (2010)

#86

RIP Checkbox, 1990-2009, you were perfect and unambiguous but for some reason smartphone designers hated you.

I agree that checkboxes are perfect; but that's because I never try to fill forms on a smartphone. Native browser checkboxes are often unusable on smartphones; too small to hit with a thumb.

Re: Should toggle button show its current state or the state to which it'll change? (2010)

#87
post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can someone make a car which has none of the complicated stuff? List of features I want: - automatic transmission (if ICE) - bluetooth and FM radio - no self steering - cruise control with "follow speed" - not-batshit-insane self-brake-system (use whatever Volvo uses, it works!) - good airbags and decent structural integrity - classic sedan height

> cruise control with "follow speed" If I'm reading you right, you want your car to follow the speed of the car in front of you? Usually delivered by radar assisted cruise control? That's complicated stuff, and you'll probably get lane keeping assistance too, because it's a package. At least on my car with lane keeping, there's a big button in the center console to disable it.

The last car I rented handled this package terribly. There was a way to disable the lane assistance, but it was a couple of steps and you had to perform them every time you started the car because it wouldn't remember your preference.

Re: Should toggle button show its current state or the state to which it'll change? (2010)

#88
post #71

I'm surprised we are still iterating on ideas like this, to be honest. Seems flight decks have been rather successful on complicated dashboards for a long time. Same with boats. Why can we take approximately no lessons from them?

The interfaces you are talking about require years of training, study and passing multiple tests to demonstrate proficiency. In software UX we are talking about discoverability and approachability for the untrained operator.

Most of the training is to know which ones need to be on and which ones need to be off. Not how to read various buttons as on or off. And the point there is they are able to rapidly scan a dashboard to know what is on and off at a glance.

Similarly, sliders and levers help you see which ones are maxed out and which ones are set at a rough 50% or similar.

Re: Should toggle button show its current state or the state to which it'll change? (2010)

#89

I have some old NASA push button switches that have two bulbs in them. When the switch is off both lights are off, when you click the switch the yellow bulb comes on and lights up the switch, and when the device you turned on actually turns on a green light turns on ( and the yellow turns off ). The idea is you push the button and the yellow state is the confirmation that you toggled the switch, but the green is the…

This is a good one, and also what airplanes do[1]. These problems are solved by people who care a lot about usability, but computer people are slow to pick up this sort of stuff from other fields.

Labels outside the switch also work.[2]

[1]: https://my737ng.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/08/cp_mcp_header...

[2]: https://i.pinimg.com/originals/2c/37/0a/2c370a3f4018cfa9c3ef...

Re: Should toggle button show its current state or the state to which it'll change? (2010)

#90
post #71

I'm surprised we are still iterating on ideas like this, to be honest. Seems flight decks have been rather successful on complicated dashboards for a long time. Same with boats. Why can we take approximately no lessons from them?

Perhaps what we do on a pc is not really that complicated or critical compared to flying a plane or steering an oil tanker. Just a thought.

I mean, sure? But, to that point, why discuss the conventions? If the goal is to have a predictable interface, it seems fair and in scope to study larger interfaces that people have to read quickly.
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