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Spain lives in flats: why we have built our cities vertically

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Re: Spain lives in flats: why we have built our cities vertically

#81

Post by dfxm12 »

xyzelement wrote: post #61
browningstreet wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I live in northern Nevada in an exurb. I go for a walk everyday that requires me to go on a road for half a mile before I get to the dirt path. On that half mile road the traffic is so constant and so loud (from my small gated community) I can’t hear whatever I’m listening to on my headphones. The clamor is so aggravating I’m usually a bit angry by the time I hit the dirt path. My exurb neighbors (multiple) have loud…

I am just curious- why did you opt for a place that is so out of sync w what matters to you ?

Not OP, but there's so many general reasons someone buys this place:

- They didn't opt for the place, someone else in their family did

- This is where the jobs were

- What matters to them changed over time

- The place changed over time

- A lot of things matter to them, this is just one, and the place delivers on the others

- When they were looking for a place, this was what was available

- etc.

Re: Spain lives in flats: why we have built our cities vertically

#82

Post by kraig911 »

matsemann wrote: post #52
mathieuh wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I live in northern ireland in an actual house and the walls are thin enough I could dip my bread into my neighbours' soup. It is the number one reason I could never see myself living in an apartment, I'm very sensitive to noise and I get disproportionately angry at even low levels of unwanted noise. I'd be too worried about noise from neighbours.

I live in a modern apartment in Norway (2019). I guess some of our heat insulation demands make it so that we get extra thick walls and floors, but I've never heard any noise from neighbors. No tv sounds, no stamping feet etc. Maybe twice a year someone drills a hole to mount something on the walls and I hear that for a few minutes. Even have a train passing by outside I can't hear with the windows closed. Point bein…

Norwegians are also some of those most quiet people I've ever met.

Re: Spain lives in flats: why we have built our cities vertically

#83

Post by dvt »

A bit ironic how the first example is of La Coruña and literally everyone from there absolutely hates the fact that the ugly brutalist Franco-era flats absolutely destroyed the vibe of the coastal cities in Galicia (e.g. Cayon, O Grove, Baiona, etc.). My sister lives in Santiago de Compostela and her in-laws are from the area so I've had a lot of conversations with them.

Re: Spain lives in flats: why we have built our cities vertically

#84

Post by mupuff1234 »

whalesalad wrote: post #3

Different strokes for different folks. I’m a very happy single family home dweller. Living in a dense city feels claustrophobic.

Have you ever lived in a city?

There's also a pretty big variance between a European city for example which usually doesn't have very tall high rises, and living in midtown Manhattan.

Re: Spain lives in flats: why we have built our cities vertically

#85

Post by itointegral »

Vinnl wrote: post #72

What's interesting is that the Netherlands is pretty low on the list of countries with the highest percentage of people in collective dwellings (at 21% vs Spain's 65%, only the UK is lower), even though it's one of the most densely populated countries in Europe. I suppose that's the result of the mentioned "mushroom neighbourhoods"? Great visuals btw.

That's what surprised me too. I think it might be because for every big, dense Dutch city there are n farmhouses in Friesland, Groningen, etc. Also I'm not sure whether they categorise semidetached houses as houses or flats, given how common they are in the Netherlands the 21% would be no surprise if they're considered houses.

Re: Spain lives in flats: why we have built our cities vertically

#86

Post by rickydroll »

astronads wrote: post #71
flagged24 wrote: post #15

I'm okay with these high rises so I can enjoy the quiet tranquility of rural Spain. Everytime we do stay in an apartment in Spain the lack of sound proofing really stands out. Perhaps even more so because everything is tiled, no carpets.

There’s evidence that constant unwanted noise can negatively impact our health: https://archive.ph/5mvYQ (nytimes) I don’t mind visiting cities, but I certainly would never live in one.

When I live in rural low noise areas bp is 125/75 range. high noise areas bp is 155/105 range. BP drugs only drop it a little.

Unfortunately just bought a house in a rush hour high noise area. wife loved in the house, I loved the visible sky, and we both loved the yard/garden. we saw it on a Sunday (very quiet day. :) Now I have a hard time being outside or taking my scope out for observing.

Waiting for a stroke or kidney failure from the high BP.

Re: Spain lives in flats: why we have built our cities vertically

#87

Post by switch007 »

outside1234 wrote: post #74
bedobi wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

was gonna comment the same :melting face: I'm an armchair urbanist and all about density, and in well built buildings it's fine, even with tiled floors you can't really hear your neighbors but in Spain it's as if the buildings are built with zero soundproofing - you hear every single neighbor in the whole building and their tvs, radios, conversations, footsteps... it's maddening, I don't understand it

The Spanish love the noise is my theory. They are a very social people. They probably think of it as comforting versus annoying, and like the person that lives next to the waterfall that can't hear it, it probably fades into the background of their consciousness. (I lived in Spain for two years.)

> The Spanish love the noise is my theory

Totally. I think to them it represents and demonstrates liberation, freedom, fun, family and community. Loud means fun to them.

People complaining about noise are seen as serious party-poopers.

Re: Spain lives in flats: why we have built our cities vertically

#89

Post by user_7832 »

kraig911 wrote: post #82
matsemann wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I live in a modern apartment in Norway (2019). I guess some of our heat insulation demands make it so that we get extra thick walls and floors, but I've never heard any noise from neighbors. No tv sounds, no stamping feet etc. Maybe twice a year someone drills a hole to mount something on the walls and I hear that for a few minutes. Even have a train passing by outside I can't hear with the windows closed. Point bein…

Norwegians are also some of those most quiet people I've ever met.

Not disagreeing with your point but I’d like to support what the op said regarding “modern” buildings often having excellent sound deadening. My previous Dutch residence also had those “fake” (non concrete) walls but I couldn’t hear others in their rooms even when they played loud music (and they had different nationalities). But if no effort goes into soundproofing, it can be unsurprisingly pretty bad.

Re: Spain lives in flats: why we have built our cities vertically

#90

Post by rsynnott »

hbarka wrote: post #53
rsynnott wrote: post #19

> Only in South Korea more people live in collective dwellings than in Spain. I... have doubts. (Looks like they're only looking at OECD countries, so Singapore and HK, the most obvious counter-examples, are excluded.)

I agree with you. Also, comparing by countries is intuitively not a good measure due to the averaging out of highs and lows. It would be absurd to compare Spain versus Alaska or Texas but these are two US states larger than Spain. How about comparing by cities? How does Madrid fare versus New York City or Chicago or Hong Kong?

You then get into messy definitional stuff; what's a city, anyway? :)
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