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India’s pickle people: Decades-old culinary heirlooms, nostalgia

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Re: India’s pickle people: Decades-old culinary heirlooms, nostalgia

#81

Post by hn_throwaway_99 »

dilawar wrote: post #39

Ah, the "achaar". So wrongly translated as "pickle". In my village (Ganges plain, North India), making achaar was a significant seasonal community event. When mangoes were small, we used to wait for heavy winds during early monsoon. A lot of raw mangoes would fall on the ground, and the next day they would be sold at a much cheaper price. There were two broad classes of mango varieties: one for eating ripe, and the o…

> Some members of this famous group were from lower castes, and obviously, they were not allowed to physically touch the pickle.

Obviously...

I really enjoyed your post, but that part is just so shitty (not commenting on you, just the dynamic that exists).

Re: India’s pickle people: Decades-old culinary heirlooms, nostalgia

#82

Post by ssivark »

dilawar wrote: post #65
Metacelsus wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>My contribution to this was introducing potassium permanganate as an extra layer to fight fungus. It is still known as "achaar powder" in the village. Did people end up eating potassium permanganate? I think that would be pretty toxic.

I hope not. It was meant to be sprinkled on the top after oil and salt has been added. Besides’ we didn’t know that it was toxic. I read about it in my chemistry book and it is available in a medical store. I am more worried about people keeping insecticides in husked and unhusked rice. Trace amounts of insecticides is very common in grains here. I hope this improves soon since epigenetic changes due to insecticides…

Love the story about the interplay between textbook chemistry and traditional food practices :-)

Re: India’s pickle people: Decades-old culinary heirlooms, nostalgia

#83

Post by guntherhermann »

hn_throwaway_99 wrote: post #81
dilawar wrote: post #39

Ah, the "achaar". So wrongly translated as "pickle". In my village (Ganges plain, North India), making achaar was a significant seasonal community event. When mangoes were small, we used to wait for heavy winds during early monsoon. A lot of raw mangoes would fall on the ground, and the next day they would be sold at a much cheaper price. There were two broad classes of mango varieties: one for eating ripe, and the o…

> Some members of this famous group were from lower castes, and obviously, they were not allowed to physically touch the pickle. Obviously... I really enjoyed your post, but that part is just so shitty (not commenting on you, just the dynamic that exists).

It's very interesting though isn't it! These people were obviously skilled enough to make a clean environment for pickle to... pickle, but were seen as untouchable.

I would have thought that the juxtaposition was so obvious that the people who weren't 'untouchable' didn't really believe it, but went along with it because everyone else did, too.

I think this is probably a kind of pluralistic ignorance: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pluralistic_ignorance

Re: India’s pickle people: Decades-old culinary heirlooms, nostalgia

#84

Post by halostatue »

silverpepsi wrote: post #58
kumarvvr wrote: post #56

Yeah, this is not the western idea of Pickle. These are long lasting, chilli powder filled, Mustard powder based goodness, that is tasty throughout the year, filling and an absolute delight. There are so many fond memories of eating mango pickle with steaming hot rice, in the hot summers in my home. In every Indian Home (at least in the south that I know about), you will find at least a couple of these pickles stocke…

Lol "famous"? Sorry I don't think a pickle can be famous but ya know different strokes.

famous | ˈfeɪməs | adjective 1 known about by many people: a famous star | the country is famous for its natural beauty. 2 informal excellent: Galway stormed to a famous victory.

Various types of pickles are in fact "famous":

- Mango pickle (not my favourite Indian pickle; right now that would be garlic pickle and my standby is lime pickle)

- New York deli half-sour pickled cucumbers (not a vinegar pickle, but a fermented pickle).

- Umeboshi (salt-pickled Japanese plums)

- Kimchi (Korean fermented cabbage and vegetables)

- Kapusta / Sauerkraut (Ukrainian and German fermented/pickled cabbage, respectively)

There are others, but the point has been made. When you consider that "famous" is often used to mean "beloved", your ignorance is showing.

Re: India’s pickle people: Decades-old culinary heirlooms, nostalgia

#85

Post by plastic_bag »

dilawar wrote: post #39

Ah, the "achaar". So wrongly translated as "pickle". In my village (Ganges plain, North India), making achaar was a significant seasonal community event. When mangoes were small, we used to wait for heavy winds during early monsoon. A lot of raw mangoes would fall on the ground, and the next day they would be sold at a much cheaper price. There were two broad classes of mango varieties: one for eating ripe, and the o…

This brings back memories of my childhood. I am from a coastal village in (northern) Andhra Pradesh, India.

We call it "పచ్చడి" (pachchadi) in Telugu. If it were to be made in a process usual to the rest of the state (or the country), it would not last longer due the village's close proximity to the sea.

So my aunt and grandmother would also add jaggery to the pickle, to stop it from developing fungus sooner and to give it a sweet taste along with sour and spicy taste mango pickles are known for. This addition would give the pickle a deeper colour.

I always preferred it over the regular mango pickle.

Re: India’s pickle people: Decades-old culinary heirlooms, nostalgia

#86

Post by halostatue »

OJFord wrote: post #63
kumarvvr wrote: post #56

Yeah, this is not the western idea of Pickle. These are long lasting, chilli powder filled, Mustard powder based goodness, that is tasty throughout the year, filling and an absolute delight. There are so many fond memories of eating mango pickle with steaming hot rice, in the hot summers in my home. In every Indian Home (at least in the south that I know about), you will find at least a couple of these pickles stocke…

> Yeah, this is not the western idea of Pickle. > These are long lasting, chilli powder filled, Mustard powder based goodness, that is tasty throughout the year, filling and an absolute delight. Achar right? 'Pickle' is exactly what I'd (white British) call it, and vice versa not be surprised when it was what I was given. Maybe you're thinking of American 'dill pickle' (where the pickle stands for 'with pickled cucum…

As a bit of a pickle enthusiast, I must object to the idea that it is "vegetables in vinegar and not a lot else".

I was looking at making various Japanese pickles last year and rice bran with miso is a very common dry pickling bed; salt pickles are far more common than vinegar pickles (the recipe book I looked at had about ¼ of its pickles with some sort of vinegar, usually a rice vinegar).

Even vinegar-based Western pickles are far more interesting than "just vinegar", because most pickles have herbs and spices (pickled dill cucumbers have dill, garlic, and often mustard seed or coriander, sometimes chilli flakes). Also fairly common in Western pickles are wine pickles (not for cucumbers; sometimes used to finish the aging of sauerkraut) or salt pickles (preserved lemon, most sauerkrauts, the better pickled dill cucumbers).

And then you get the interesting pickles like Branston Pickle (more accurately called a chutney made with pickled vegetables, but…).

I also buy quite a few oil-pickled products from Italy; I suspect that many Mediterranean cultures use oil pickling over vinegar pickling. (Although the production methods for most of these would start with brining — salt pickling — they would be dried and the curing would be finished in the oil that they ship in.)

Re: India’s pickle people: Decades-old culinary heirlooms, nostalgia

#87

Post by halostatue »

spaceman_2020 wrote: post #20
satvikpendem wrote: post #17

I make pickles like these, but I've never seen them that old. Generally we make them and eat them within several months, then make more. Mango pickle is my favorite as it has just the right spiciness, while lemon pickles are often too sour for my taste. If you want to try them, they are usually at your local Indian grocery store. These pickles are mainly eaten with rice or dishes like dosas and idlis, often when you…

To add: if you are buying them from a store, you will need to try multiple brands before you find the one that’s right for you. Unlike western-style pickles, the taste can vary very wildly across brands.

Oh yes.

My personal go-tos are Shan and Deep (I really like the Shan garlic pickle and the Deep lemon and lime pickles; they both make competent mixed achar). If I can’t find either of those, I will settle for Patak's over other brands I have not tried (there are some I have tried and Do Not Like).

Re: India’s pickle people: Decades-old culinary heirlooms, nostalgia

#88

Post by danans »

guntherhermann wrote: post #83
hn_throwaway_99 wrote: post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Some members of this famous group were from lower castes, and obviously, they were not allowed to physically touch the pickle. Obviously... I really enjoyed your post, but that part is just so shitty (not commenting on you, just the dynamic that exists).

It's very interesting though isn't it! These people were obviously skilled enough to make a clean environment for pickle to... pickle, but were seen as untouchable. I would have thought that the juxtaposition was so obvious that the people who weren't 'untouchable' didn't really believe it, but went along with it because everyone else did, too. I think this is probably a kind of pluralistic ignorance: https://en.wiki…

> It's very interesting though isn't it! These people were obviously skilled enough to make a clean environment for pickle to... pickle, but were seen as untouchable.

There are often whole systems of technicalities created to rationalize these contradictions.

Here's an even more striking example (priests using clay from the ground of the house of a prostitute to make an icon for a religious festival):

https://www.india.com/viral/why-is-the-soil-from-outside-a-p...

There are all kinds of these scenarios that happen when theoretical social hierarchy comes into practical contact with the lived reality of people in interdependent communities.

Re: India’s pickle people: Decades-old culinary heirlooms, nostalgia

#89

Post by nischalsamji »

plastic_bag wrote: post #85
dilawar wrote: post #39

Ah, the "achaar". So wrongly translated as "pickle". In my village (Ganges plain, North India), making achaar was a significant seasonal community event. When mangoes were small, we used to wait for heavy winds during early monsoon. A lot of raw mangoes would fall on the ground, and the next day they would be sold at a much cheaper price. There were two broad classes of mango varieties: one for eating ripe, and the o…

This brings back memories of my childhood. I am from a coastal village in (northern) Andhra Pradesh, India. We call it "పచ్చడి" (pachchadi) in Telugu. If it were to be made in a process usual to the rest of the state (or the country), it would not last longer due the village's close proximity to the sea. So my aunt and grandmother would also add jaggery to the pickle, to stop it from developing fungus sooner and to g…

the right term is ఊరగాయ or ఆవకాయ.

Re: India’s pickle people: Decades-old culinary heirlooms, nostalgia

#90

Post by [deleted] »

dilawar wrote: post #39

Ah, the "achaar". So wrongly translated as "pickle". In my village (Ganges plain, North India), making achaar was a significant seasonal community event. When mangoes were small, we used to wait for heavy winds during early monsoon. A lot of raw mangoes would fall on the ground, and the next day they would be sold at a much cheaper price. There were two broad classes of mango varieties: one for eating ripe, and the o…

[deleted]
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