Live data from Hacker News

AWS Customers Cannot Escape IPv4

tty.neveragain.de

81–90 of 316 posts

Re: AWS Customers Cannot Escape IPv4

#81
As an AWS customer I want to escape IP entirely. It's a waste of time managing these complex networking systems with their archaic protocols (IP, BGP, DNS, etc)

Just let me strongly associate identities with my workloads and apply policy indicating which workloads should be able to send data with which other workloads.

How data gets from one workload to another should not even be my concern, just make it happen.

Re: AWS Customers Cannot Escape IPv4

#82

As an AWS customer I want to escape IP entirely. It's a waste of time managing these complex networking systems with their archaic protocols (IP, BGP, DNS, etc) Just let me strongly associate identities with my workloads and apply policy indicating which workloads should be able to send data with which other workloads. How data gets from one workload to another should not even be my concern, just make it happen.

While your sentiment is valid, this is the type of argument people make on low code solutions. Which has never worked in reality and never will. There's just too much nuance and detail that needs to be considered when you have to do and optimize real workloads.

Re: AWS Customers Cannot Escape IPv4

#83
post #32
post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Right, cause customers are too stupid to manage their own IPv6 firewalls, it's for their own good! /s

Well, I wouldn't put _any_ service on a public network, unless it is explicitly required. Firewall is all well and good, but security in depth is even better. Private networking is good. IPv6 doesn't help here at all.

Therefore job security of old school network administrators is the main factor against IPv6 coverage.

Hopefully one of the big cloud providers figures it is in their best interest to have a much bigger address space and make all this busywork sinecure obsolete.

Re: AWS Customers Cannot Escape IPv4

#84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Comcast at some point stopped letting you administrate your own router. You can log in to it, but port forwarding is no longer available through the administration interface. If you want port forwarding, they recommend that you do... something. It's not clear what; what you can find on the internet is mostly just people complaining that they insisted to customer support that they needed port forwarding, customer supp…

One cannot unplug the Comcast issued router, power cycle the modem, and plug in a customer owned router?

All I see are combo units these days.

Re: AWS Customers Cannot Escape IPv4

#85
> There is no concept of private addresses in IPv6, which means farewell to the Managed NAT Gateway and its magnificent pricing.

Maybe not in AWS, but there are Unique Local IPv6 addresses in fc00::/7 and NAT66 if you really love NAT!

Re: AWS Customers Cannot Escape IPv4

#86

Off topic: Does anyone know if this page is generated from a Static-Site generator starting from Markdown? I currently use Hugo and my blog is in Markdown in git, but the theme is pretty heavy-weight, and I like this look of the page in OP; Looking at the source, it's so minimal!

Yes, it's Markdown and I use https://jekyllrb.com with the theme "jekyll-theme-hacker" to generate the site. I quite like how simple it is.

Amazing, thank you!

Re: AWS Customers Cannot Escape IPv4

#87
post #27
post #3

It would really help if there were real ISP competition in the USA. There's only one actually broadband ISP provider where I rent, which is in the suburbs near Seattle. It's NOT a rural area by any definition, and yet Comcast is my only option. Their price and service reflect that reality...

IPv6 adoption is only going to further the consolidation of customers onto the big monopoly providers. They will be the only ones who can afford to add the dedicated network engineering staff to make it work reliably. Most people don't realize there are two IPv6 internets right now, the Cogent side and the Hurricane Electric side. Both are equally sized and refuse to connect to each other, so you need to know that an…

> two IPv6 internets right now, the Cogent side and the Hurricane Electric side

Cogent engages in peering spats on IPv4 too; this dynamic is not new with or unique to IPv6, or limited to Cogent/HE. The lesson here is to not go singlehomed under Cogent, not to reject IPv6.

Re: AWS Customers Cannot Escape IPv4

#88
post #4

It seems obviously against AWS incentives to offer working v6 - all their influencing tools ("well architected" criteria, certificates) strongly herd you towards building mazes of ambigously addressed 10.x RFC1918 networks, and not internet style architectures with end-to-end addressing. In the world of their recommendations, even the concept of a "public ip address" is a red flag, and AWS even recommends (for an add…

Azure is copying this wholesale. I've lost track of all of the "Private Endpoints", "Private Links", "Service Endpoints", "Private Resolvers" and "Virtual WAN" products they've introduced... all to make IPv4 work at scale. Literally none of those products would be required if they had just made IPv6 work properly. Instead, they NAT IPv6, so you can't even use it to avoid the NAT forced upon you by IPv4. They also rel…

A lot of IT folks are still fearful of IPv6. I've been on calls where people disable IPv6 as a matter of "best practice." It's sad. People will gladly learn the latest flavor of the month web framework but won't take time to gain experience with a fundamental protocol.

Re: AWS Customers Cannot Escape IPv4

#89
post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you get a /48 you can probably evade the problem by assigning a /64 for your proxy at a time. You will have another ~65,500 such blocks for use. Yes, some might just block the /56 (you would still have another ~250 chances) or /48 but nothing is perfect.

but how do I change the IPv6 address in AWS? I can just assign a new Static IP for IPv4

Same thing for IPv6, but instead of assigning a new singular IPv6, you assign a new subnet with millions of IPv6 addresses.

Re: AWS Customers Cannot Escape IPv4

#90
post #14

There needs to be a body of law relating to technical matters like this (and interoperability etc) that is adjacent to competition law. Some things we just need everyone to be on the same page about. It is manifestly the case that ipv6 is never going to be that, because the incentives to invest simply don't exist for companies like AWS. This distorts the market in eyeball networks and hosting - the former are under l…

The EU did have a mandate for government services to use IPv6, but the programme it was part of got replaced by another that didn't include IPv6. The European Commission did advocate for IPv6 use, but, the EU being the EU, motivated their recommendation by complaining that law enforcement had issues tracking down people behind CGNAT, and made clear that they wanted every IP address to point to a specific person for l…

> ISPs can CGNAT for cheap

Not really that cheap. While CPAEX is CAPEX, OPEX is still a thing and operating CGNAT requires efforts. Also some (most?) CGNAT implementations are buggy and is not a good user experience, even for users who don't understand the concept of IP at all.

Post reply on HN