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I'd Love to Move, but I Can't

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Re: I'd Love to Move, but I Can't

#81

Post by illumin8 »

jdludlow wrote: post #67
GFischer wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As someone from South America, I'm amazed that in the U.S. you're out of health coverage if you're not employed. Other safety nets are counterproductive, though. My country has very high firing costs, which means less jobs, and job security is very highly tied to years in the job, so in my case, leaving my dead-end but decently paid job for a better job is a very significant gamble (I basically give up all my unemplo…

As someone from South America, I'm amazed that in the U.S. you're out of health coverage if you're not employed. You're not. The tax structure encourages this kind of behavior, but the day I quit my job 5 years ago I started cutting a check for my own health insurance. If people actually looked into the cost of catastrophic coverage with a high deductible (the point of "insurance" in the first place), they'd see that…

Cutting a check is pretty difficult when you stop receiving a salary. The logic of the US system is incredible: Pay a few hundred dollars a month while employed for coverage from your employer, or if they lay you off, you have the opportunity of picking up COBRA coverage by paying both the employee and employer portion for over a thousand dollars a month. In what other first world country do the newly unemployed pay 3x the price for healthcare that the gainfully employed do? Once your COBRA benefits expire in 18 months, you can expect to pay even more as now you have to shop on the open market and a lot of insurance carriers just flat out refuse to sell insurance to a single family.

Re: I'd Love to Move, but I Can't

#82

Post by tmh88j »

jiggy2011 wrote: post #63
true_religion wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Small business (or as call it "cottage industry") was the way many people survived in cities before the industrial revolution hit it stride. I don't believe its beyond the capabilities of mere mortals today to do. What people dislike about entrepreneurship is the search for something to sell to people. On the otherhand, many would prefer working for themselves if it could pay, and they had a clearly defined role to s…

The difference between pre-industrial and now is that you now not only have to find a product/service to sell but you have to find something that the large wallmart style corporations can't do quicker, better and cheaper than you can. Even small software companies now have the risk of Apple etc completely removing their distribution channel on a whim or a larger software company (or open source project) just replicat…

>a larger software company (or open source project) just replicating their entire product.

Agreed for products that are specific service, but if your product is driven by a users(facebook and twitter for example), it's damn near impossible for other companies to push you out of the way and achieve the same results once you reach a large enough user base. I'm not saying it doesn't happen, especially between generations of software, but usually not concurrently. (google+ vs facebook?)

Re: I'd Love to Move, but I Can't

#83

Post by true_religion »

jiggy2011 wrote: post #63
true_religion wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Small business (or as call it "cottage industry") was the way many people survived in cities before the industrial revolution hit it stride. I don't believe its beyond the capabilities of mere mortals today to do. What people dislike about entrepreneurship is the search for something to sell to people. On the otherhand, many would prefer working for themselves if it could pay, and they had a clearly defined role to s…

The difference between pre-industrial and now is that you now not only have to find a product/service to sell but you have to find something that the large wallmart style corporations can't do quicker, better and cheaper than you can. Even small software companies now have the risk of Apple etc completely removing their distribution channel on a whim or a larger software company (or open source project) just replicat…

True, post-industrial society has forced everyone to act like traders and back in the day no one wanted to be a trader because you had to contend with guild monopolies, merchant princes, thieves making off with your goods, wolves in the brush, having your ship sink, having your horse go lame from beneath you, and ofcourse... the excessive taxes leveed against anyone not doing exactly what the extablishment wanted.

At least now adays, we don't have to worry about wolves.

Re: I'd Love to Move, but I Can't

#84

Post by ceejayoz »

InclinedPlane wrote: post #74
pavel_lishin wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> You can get from pretty much anywhere in the US to anywhere else for under $500. Unless you need to break the lease on your apartment, which is typically two months' rent - which typically tacks on another $1000, minimum.

If you are unemployed and just out of college you're living at home, not in an apartment.

Or you've been living in an apartment while in college.

Re: I'd Love to Move, but I Can't

#85

Post by true_religion »

jdludlow wrote: post #69
jandrewrogers wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This. There is a large segment of the American population that cannot fathom living a life not based on gross consumerism. It is a crippling behavior when you have little income and are just starting out because it prevents you from accumulating the savings required for economic flexibility. When I was in my 20s and poor, I think the most I ever spent on drinking glasses in total was a few dollars, and I moved many t…

Amen. The trait of rich people that I try to emulate (not always successfully) is that they tend to purchase assets that appreciate in value. Toys are paid for with highly disposable money and not the nest egg. The trait of poor people that I try to avoid is purchasing depreciating assets, usually on credit ensuring that you'll be poor until that lotto ticket hits big (i.e. forever).

Isn't this pretty hard?

Most assets depreciate. Here's a non-exhaustive list: furniture, kitchen supplies, food, electronics, and vehicles.

It seems like it'd be hard if you're poor to avoid having a large chunk of your income go towards things that depreciate immediately you touch them.

Re: I'd Love to Move, but I Can't

#86

Post by hnal943 »

DanBC wrote: post #7
tseabrooks wrote: post #2

I'm 27 so I think I'm just a couple years outside of this generation that can't find jobs. That said, I'm pretty sick and damned tired of seeing lists of things keeping these 20-somethings from succeeding. It's time for people to man up (Though I'm not excluding women) and take responsibility for themselves and stop complaining about externalities keeping them from success and just go out and succeed. The problem isn…

Harsh. Let's assume, for this discussion, that what you say is true, and that many people are stuck by perceived not actual problems. That's not good for them, or for the economy. What would you do to help them move forward with their life? How would you help them break out of this cycle? What changes would you make? Or is it really as simple as telling them to "man up"? To "get on their bike"[1]? [1] ( http://en.wik…

It is constructive to have social pressure against failure. These people have no shame about their situation, because it's socially acceptable to blame their problems on others. Referring to this group as "Generation Stuck" is indicative of this coddling culture.

Re: I'd Love to Move, but I Can't

#87

Post by presidentender »

zdw wrote: post #6

The fundamental problem in most of these is "lack of a safety net". While there are safety nets in society they often exclude the years when someone is most likely to take economic risks - for example, in the US a minimum free medical coverage is provided to those people under 18 or over 65. Personally, I'm thinking that if people knew they couldn't incur permanent damage to themselves or their futures, they would ta…

Hundreds of dollars spending on drinking glasses, and we need a safety net?

Re: I'd Love to Move, but I Can't

#88

Post by kstrauser »

cletus wrote: post #30

Reading through this list of anecdotes I had mixed emotions. I spent a significant amount of time unemployed 10+ years ago in the post-dotcom recession in the UK and it was awful. This was partly due to the highly unregulated nature of UK IT recruitment but the problem was the lack of jobs. Still, a see some problems in this article. Like "I graduated with a philosophy major in 2008". Bzzzzt. Sorry, you made choices.…

I'm married with four kids and currently in the process of moving from Nebraska to San Francisco. We're selling almost everything we own except for family heirlooms and other things like that, with the goal of replacing them here after we're moved. I mean, I like the stuff we own or I wouldn't have bought it in the first place, but they'll make more.

We have a nice couch, but they sell nice couches in CA. I can pick up Ikea dressers off Craigslist for the cost of renting a pickup truck for an hour. I'm ditching clothes that don't fit or are outdated - I didn't wear them anyway. While my family is preparing to come join me, I'm living in a rented room for dirt cheap and loving it.

You are so right about your things owning you. Right now, I'm owned by my laptop, a Nook, and a closet sparsely filled with a few clothes I actually like to wear. I think I'd enjoy a chair so that I don't have to sit on my bed or the floor to work, but there's no rush.

Re: I'd Love to Move, but I Can't

#89

Post by namdnay »

zdw wrote: post #6

The fundamental problem in most of these is "lack of a safety net". While there are safety nets in society they often exclude the years when someone is most likely to take economic risks - for example, in the US a minimum free medical coverage is provided to those people under 18 or over 65. Personally, I'm thinking that if people knew they couldn't incur permanent damage to themselves or their futures, they would ta…

I don't think that's true. Take France for example. We have an amazing safety net, and yet people here are far less entrepreneurial than in the US.

Re: I'd Love to Move, but I Can't

#90

Post by simcop2387 »

cletus wrote: post #30

Reading through this list of anecdotes I had mixed emotions. I spent a significant amount of time unemployed 10+ years ago in the post-dotcom recession in the UK and it was awful. This was partly due to the highly unregulated nature of UK IT recruitment but the problem was the lack of jobs. Still, a see some problems in this article. Like "I graduated with a philosophy major in 2008". Bzzzzt. Sorry, you made choices.…

The things in there adress what you're advocating there. You're basically advocating to live what the article calls a "vagabond" Not having anything at all, just a bed, clothes and a laptop. That's not a lot more than what some people consider a "homeless" person to have. Of course that being said, there are going to be times where you've really got to go do that kind of thing. I'm actually looking at doing almost that myself I've just been trying to figure out what area to do it in. I've had some interviews local and some prospects across the country but so far nothing that has managed to come close to panning out. My advice would be to also cut way back on expenses and consider doing what I'm doing right now. I'm living with a relative for $250/mo and doing contract work for about $14/hr. Doesn't pay well, isn't satisfying but it pays the bills and what debt I have and is flexible enough that I'm able to travel as long as I can plan a week ahead for an interview so that I can travel on the weekend/at night and make sure I'll be able to work from wherever I'm staying at.
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