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OwnCloud Infinite Scale added EULA that prohibits commercial use [pdf]

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Re: OwnCloud Infinite Scale added EULA that prohibits commercial use [pdf]

#81

Post by plagiarist »

dylan604 wrote: post #69
plagiarist wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's definitely a mistake for it to be like that, but it doesn't seem like a big problem in practice.

Why is it a mistake? If you have not modified the code, then the source code is available via the same place they received it. It sounds like you just want anyone using the code to automatically become a mirror

It is a mistake for the intent of GPL licenses because if the place they received it closes down it can become difficult to get the source / de facto closed source.

The solution to this is for every place using the software to become a mirror or otherwise allow access to the source code in the same way as if they were distributing GPL binaries, correct.

Re: OwnCloud Infinite Scale added EULA that prohibits commercial use [pdf]

#82

Post by plagiarist »

dragooc wrote: post #79
plagiarist wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Am I reading correctly that building from source would still allow for commercial hosting contexts (subject to AGPL)? If that is the case, I don't understand how the EULA benefits anyone enough to want it.

The source is available under free licenses, so you can build and do with it what these licenses allow, which is basically anything. Most serious companies however appreciate a proper business relationship with defined, vendor supplied builds, that they can plan with etc. Remember that somebody who builds from source can not call us asking for reactions of any kind. That is were the EULA comes to value.

Thank you, that makes a bit more sense.

Re: OwnCloud Infinite Scale added EULA that prohibits commercial use [pdf]

#83

Post by j1elo »

2Gkashmiri wrote: post #51
SamuelAdams wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For a while I thought it was AGPL, but after reading it it looks like there are no provisions against using the code for commercial purposes, only that if source code is used, the modified source code must also be made available to the public.

I was recently involved in a decison where a company was thinking of reusing code of agpl into proprietary software. The end result was "if you are using the agpl code as an api enfpoint or you are just reusing the code without any modifications, you don't have to share your entire code to customers because if vitality. Vitality would come up if you modify the code. You can just show you are using agpl code in a lice…

Are you sure about that "or"? ("or you are just reusing the code without any modifications")

Afaik due to the virality of GPL, as soon as your proprietary product makes use of a GPL or AGPL library (where "makes use" is my way of saying "links against" in the license parlance), the whole product would need to be distributed under the same (A)GPL license.

Re: OwnCloud Infinite Scale added EULA that prohibits commercial use [pdf]

#84

Post by pxc »

hoistbypetard wrote: post #70
pxc wrote: post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No. Software with a EULA like this is not free or open-source software. It violates freedom 0 of the fundamental software freedoms (FSF terminology) and the 'no discrimination against fields of endeavor' clause of the Open-Source Definition (OSI terminology). Putting a restrictive EULA on a permissively licensed open-source project makes it non-free just like incorporating proprietary code.

You're not looking closely enough. There's no EULA on the project. There's a EULA on a specific set of binaries that are QA'd, bundled and distributed by a specific distributor associated with the project. The project itself remains open source. You can `git clone` that source and use it under the apache 2 license, which is both free and open. Furthermore, the development is still open, and there is still no CLA requ…

Ok. So OwnCloud Infinite Scale customers are not using open-source software but a proprietary product closely related to some open-source code. Just like users of VS Code, Google Chrome, macOS, most distributions of Android, IntelliJ IDEA, GitLab, etc. And like other OwnCloud Enterprise customers.

Re: OwnCloud Infinite Scale added EULA that prohibits commercial use [pdf]

#85

Post by briantakita »

stemc43 wrote: post #19
ndsipa_pomu wrote: post #3

Are they trying to push people towards NextCloud instead? I've been running an OwnCloud instance at work for some years and more recently a NextCloud instance at home. I was thinking that NextCloud was going to be the eventual upgrade path away from OwnCloud, but with their "Infinite Scale" reworking of it, I thought that maybe they were looking to take the lead again. I don't know if our usage is considered "commerc…

well, the issue is modern nextcloud vs owncloud is not what it was 5 years aog. nextcloud is still a buggy php app (without swoole) and owncloud is a completely rewritten in golang.

The High Performance Backend is written in Rust.

> nextcloud is still a buggy php app (without swoole) and owncloud is a completely rewritten in golang.

I'm just getting started with Nextcloud & did some research into the topic. My take is they are going to keep PHP due to legacy & interoperability reasons.

How is the DX in making an Owncloud App? Also, are there open source alternatives to their Enterprise features, such as Microsoft integration?

Re: OwnCloud Infinite Scale added EULA that prohibits commercial use [pdf]

#86

Post by rightbyte »

ndsipa_pomu wrote: post #67
eli wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you're not a party to the agreement then isn't possessing the software a copyright violation?

Only if you are distributing it or making a copy. As to how you came into possession of the software without making a copy is another question.

You could use someone else's computer or maybe you have bought one 2nd handand never agreed to any EULA.

Re: OwnCloud Infinite Scale added EULA that prohibits commercial use [pdf]

#87

Post by CrLf »

yjftsjthsd-h wrote: post #74
KronisLV wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> basically an Anti-AWS clause to protect against the ElasticSearch/OpenSearch thing. I wonder what the best license would be for the projects that want something like this? I mean SSPL got a lot of flak. Something like BSL was regarded more positively, but also was meant for a slightly different use case.

Just use AGPL; it doesn't actually restrict anything legally, but none of the big cloud providers will touch it.

No companies will touch it either.

Re: OwnCloud Infinite Scale added EULA that prohibits commercial use [pdf]

#88

Post by ndsipa_pomu »

rightbyte wrote: post #86
ndsipa_pomu wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Only if you are distributing it or making a copy. As to how you came into possession of the software without making a copy is another question.

You could use someone else's computer or maybe you have bought one 2nd handand never agreed to any EULA.

Well that would be unlicensed usage of the software, but not copyright infringement by yourself. Resale of software is a trickier topic which may be covered by consumer rights.

Re: OwnCloud Infinite Scale added EULA that prohibits commercial use [pdf]

#89

Post by anthonyskipper »

CrLf wrote: post #87
yjftsjthsd-h wrote: post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Just use AGPL; it doesn't actually restrict anything legally, but none of the big cloud providers will touch it.

No companies will touch it either.

This is correct ^.

Also, why should anyone want to use a crap license that restricts what you can do. As a software engineer those are crap licenses, same as a business owner, why do I want to support creation of some software that will never be a true native cloud service, I'd rather those companies and tech stacks die. The only people who care are startups who can't figure out a business model, and you should not sign up for that kind of craziness.

Re: OwnCloud Infinite Scale added EULA that prohibits commercial use [pdf]

#90

Post by justinclift »

Isn't that a strange way to do things, as it's not a licence?

That EULA document is for end users, so has no bearing upon non-end-users of the software. For example, developers.

So, developers should be able to fork the repo, change that EULA file to something else (or even just remove it), then do what they want with it.

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