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WHO advises against use of artificial sweeteners

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Re: WHO advises against use of artificial sweeteners

#81

Post by notfed »

gizmo686 wrote: post #33
WonderBuilder wrote: post #6

It feels to me that this advisory was not put out sensibly. WHO advises "against [artificial sweetener] use" because they "do not help control body mass or reduce the risk of weight-related illnesses" and because long term "[may increase the risk] of type 2 diabetes and cardiovascular disease". But is that enough reason to give such a blanket statement disallowance? What if you want to have some sweetness from time t…

The actual recommendation: > WHO suggests that non-sugar sweeteners not be used as a means of achieving weight control or reducing the risk of noncommunicable diseases (conditional recommendation) > Conditional recommendations are those recommendations for which the WHO guideline development group is less certain that the desirable consequences of implementing the recommendation outweigh the undesirable consequences…

Also:

> The recommendation is based on evidence of low certainty overall

Re: WHO advises against use of artificial sweeteners

#82

Post by klik99 »

DrThunder wrote: post #53
mike10921 wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nicotine itself is not more harmful than coffee or similar products. It is the smoking that is the main health risk. Assuming that vaping is less harmful, that would make it a win if one was to choose between smoking and vaping. Of course, doing neither is the absolute best choice.

Excuse me? That's irrevocably false. Where did you pull that misinformation from? The big vape industry? https://www.verywellhealth.com/what-is-nicotine-5075412 " There are many health risks and side effects associated with using nicotine. Some of the health risks include: Nicotine contributes to the development of emphysema—a type of chronic obstructive pulmonary disease— in smokers. It’s potentially carcinogenic. C…

We're talking about nicotine, not smoking. There is no evidence that nicotine is carcinogenic.

https://www.cancerresearchuk.org/about-cancer/causes-of-canc...

> Nicotine is the chemical that makes cigarettes addictive. But it is not responsible for the harmful effects of smoking, and nicotine does not cause cancer. People have safely used nicotine replacement therapy (NRT) to stop smoking for many years. Nicotine replacement therapy is prescribed by doctors or is available from pharmacies.

The risks for hypertension, etc is true for nicotine, because it's a stimulant, so same risks exist for coffee. There is very little conclusive evidence that nicotine (not talking about smoking or vaping) has any health effects that aren't also caused by coffee/stimulants.

The best thing you can say about vaping is that it's very understudied and long term effects are unknown, and likely has some long term effects that are bad for you.

Smokeless nicotine (swedish snus-variety) is considered very safe.

The problem is smoking and nicotine have been so intertwined for so long that when they say "Nicotine causes x" most of the time what they mean is "Smoking causes x" and maybe also "Vaping could potentially cause x"

Re: WHO advises against use of artificial sweeteners

#83

Post by gambiting »

clamprecht wrote: post #70
gambiting wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>>Diet soda actually tastes damn good these days, there isn't really a reason to drink regular soda. Oh god I couldn't disagree more. I literally can't stand the taste of diet pepsi/coke, the sweeteners leave such an awful aftertaste on my tongue.

Does Coke Zero or Pepsi Black taste any better to you? I don't like diet coke or diet pepsi, but I do like the newer coke zero.

Nope. Both Coke Zero and Pepsi Max(I guess that's what you mean by Black) are just awful, different to Diet but still bad - but I feel the same about literally any drink sweetened with aspartame/acesulfam/sucralose though. I can't imagine drinking a can of any of these - but I'll happily have a regular coke.

Re: WHO advises against use of artificial sweeteners

#84

Post by LeifCarrotson »

nashashmi wrote: post #54
gattilorenz wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Honeydew! Well, that’s actually worse than sweat…

Sweaty strawberries are amazing.

I have a few memories of picking blueberries with my mom as a kid - sweat dripped off my eyebrows, down the back of my neck and onto the strap that held the tray. She tried to get us out early, but there was a period around 10:00 just after the dew burned off when the humidity was still 100% and the sun was high enough to bake you. As a 7yo wishing I could stay home on my "hard-earned" summer vacation, most of the hardship was purely imagined. And maybe the flavor of those sweaty blueberries was imagined: I've not been able to replicate the taste for some time, even if I drag dragging my own boy to the U-Pick field. I wonder what they taste like to him.

Re: WHO advises against use of artificial sweeteners

#85

Post by 2OEH8eoCRo0 »

marliechiller wrote: post #5

So if I have to choose between diet and normal coke, which one is objectively worse for my health now?

Normal Coke is probably worse but they're both horrible.

I only drink normal Coke but sparingly. Usually I'm having water or plain black coffee. I think the takeaway is that diet Coke doesn't allow you to train yourself to enjoy normal sweet foods again. I just had an apple and strawberries and it is basically candy to me.

Edit: I have a question. Rank these food items by how healthful they are:

a) 150 calories of Coca-Cola Classic

b) 150 calories of fresh fruit

c) 0 calories of Diet Coke

Re: WHO advises against use of artificial sweeteners

#86

Post by ndsipa_pomu »

nashashmi wrote: post #56
doxeddaily wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How many fat people have you seen lose weight and keep it off forever? Not very damn many that's for sure.

how many fat people were at some time before thin? getting fat is the end result of getting old.

Most of the really old people that I see are quite thin - is that due to the long-term health effects of being overweight meaning that they don't survive as long, or is it that extreme old age (>80) also involves a reduction in appetite?

Re: WHO advises against use of artificial sweeteners

#87

Post by SirMaster »

gambiting wrote: post #83
clamprecht wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Does Coke Zero or Pepsi Black taste any better to you? I don't like diet coke or diet pepsi, but I do like the newer coke zero.

Nope. Both Coke Zero and Pepsi Max(I guess that's what you mean by Black) are just awful, different to Diet but still bad - but I feel the same about literally any drink sweetened with aspartame/acesulfam/sucralose though. I can't imagine drinking a can of any of these - but I'll happily have a regular coke.

The only one that works for me is Dr. Pepper Zero. So good.

Re: WHO advises against use of artificial sweeteners

#88

Post by mtlmtlmtlmtl »

mike10921 wrote: post #39
Someone1234 wrote: post #10

This was posted when it was published in May. To use an analogy their argument is: Vaping is bad for you, don't do it. While ignoring that a ton of people quit smoking using vapes and that they're letting the perfect be the enemy of good. Same thing with NSS. While NSS are a useful tool for sugar reduction, studies have shown that over the medium-long term, you'll want to reduce artificially sweat foods and even swea…

I fully agree. The main argument is that if you use sweeteners you will eat more sugar, so it is worse than sugar. So basically don't eat the non-poison because it will cause you to eat poison, so instead eat the poison itself. Also, there is no concrete evidence that sweeteners are bad for one's health, it's more the feeling of 'chemicals' are always bad. Sugar is clearly bad and causes obesity and diabetes. The cho…

Sugar is not poison or "clearly bad".

Sucrose is bad when eaten on its own, specifically in the abscence of fibre and other macronutrients that bring the GI down.

Re: WHO advises against use of artificial sweeteners

#89

Post by martinsnow »

Semaphor wrote: post #67
morkalork wrote: post #21

Companies need to stop using artificial sweeteners because they're just too sweet! If you ever do a low carb diet, it feels like your pallet is forever changed afterwards. Unmodified and unprocessed food taste naturally sweet on its own. Food with artificial sweeteners added tastes unbearably sweet.

I actually thought sweet stuff was sweet long before doing low-carb. I think a big difference is that here (Germany) we don’t put a ton of sugar and/or sweetener in pretty much everything. From what I’ve heard, that’s a thing in the US, and I know that it’s a thing in South Africa.

I can attest to that, coming from Denmark but living in Germany now. My wife is Thai and the food in southern Thailand can be sickly sweet, but if you travel to northern Thailand they usually leave out the sugar in foods.

Sugar and sweetners are insidious. Once you get used to sweet salads, you won't like normal salads anymore and then one start putting sweetners in every meal. It's surprising how unhealthy a salad can be.

Re: WHO advises against use of artificial sweeteners

#90

Post by Veen »

DrThunder wrote: post #53
mike10921 wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nicotine itself is not more harmful than coffee or similar products. It is the smoking that is the main health risk. Assuming that vaping is less harmful, that would make it a win if one was to choose between smoking and vaping. Of course, doing neither is the absolute best choice.

Excuse me? That's irrevocably false. Where did you pull that misinformation from? The big vape industry? https://www.verywellhealth.com/what-is-nicotine-5075412 " There are many health risks and side effects associated with using nicotine. Some of the health risks include: Nicotine contributes to the development of emphysema—a type of chronic obstructive pulmonary disease— in smokers. It’s potentially carcinogenic. C…

These are all health risks associated with smoking, not with nicotine itself. If you click through to the pages those risks link to, you'll see they are talking about smoking, not nicotine. There are some risks from nicotine (high blood pressure and faster heart rate), but it does not cause emphysema or cancer.
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