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AI browser extensions are a security nightmare

kolide.com

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Re: AI browser extensions are a security nightmare

#81
post #71
post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Would those topics that "outside academia understands AI to include" be covered in http://aima.cs.berkeley.edu ? When you say "bots in video games as AI" that's covered in the book titled Artificial Intelligence: A Modern Approach, 4th US ed. : II Problem-solving 3 Solving Problems by Searching ... 63 4 Search in Complex Environments ... 110 5 Adversarial Search and Games ... 146 6 Constraint Satisfaction Problems ..…

I think I have an original edition of that book somewhere. Good Old Fashioned AI.

My assignments (different book) for Intro to AI class were:

Boolean algebra simplifier. Given a LISP expression - for example (AND A (OR C D)) write a function to return the variables needed to make the entire expression TRUE. Return NIL if the expression is a paradox such as (AND A (NOT A)). The expressions that we were to resolve had on the order of 100-200 operators and were deeply nested. I recall that I wrote a function as part of it that I called HAMLET-P that identified terms of the form (OR 2B (NOT 2B)) and rapidly simplified them to TRUE.

Not-brute-force job scheduler. The job-shop scheduling problem ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Job-shop_scheduling ) with in order processing of multiple tasks that had dependencies. Any worker could do any task but could only do one task at a time.

The third one I don't remember what it was. I know it was there since the class had four assignments... (digging... must have been something with Prolog)

The last assignment was written in any language (I did it in C++ having had enough of LISP and I had a good model for how to do it in my head in C++). A 19,19,5 game ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/M,n,k-game ). Similar to go-maku or pente. This didn't have any constraints that go-maku has or captures that pente has. It was to use a two ply min-max tree with alpha beta pruning. It would beat me 7 out of 10 times. I could get a draw 2 out of 10 and win 1 out of 10. For fun I also learned ncurses and made it so that I could play the game with the arrow keys rather than as '10,9... oh crap, I meant 9,10'.

And I still consider all of those problems and homework assignments as "AI".

From the digging, I found a later year of the class that I took. They added a bit of neural nets in it, but other topics were still there.

By way of https://web.archive.org/web/19970214064228/http://www.cs.wis... to the professors's home page and classes taught - https://web.archive.org/web/19970224221107/http://www.cs.wis...

Professor Dryer taught a different section https://web.archive.org/web/19970508190550/http://www.cs.wis...

The domain of the AI research group at that time: https://web.archive.org/web/19970508113626/http://www.cs.wis...

Re: AI browser extensions are a security nightmare

#83
post #59
post #54

Actually, aren't all browser extensions a security nightmare? Or has something changed recently?

No, because a typical safe-to-run browser extension is written in such a way that it can be examined to see what it does. AI-based tools can’t be analyzed based on their code, so the only way to make them safe is by limiting their capabilities. Any such capability limit is likely to be either too constraining, not constraining enough, or require as much planning ability as the AI itself.

When you talk about not being able to analyze these based on their code do you mean because today they're all just calling out to OpenAI or whoever?

The risks listed in the article itself mostly seem to fall under the same, non-AI-extension, core problem of "you're given them all your data." And that's a risk for non-AI-based extensions too, but if you look at the code of an AI one, it's gonna be obvious that it's shipping it off to a third party server, right? And once that happens... you can't un-close that door.

(The risks about copyright and such of content you generate by using AI tools are interesting and different, but I don't know that I'd call them security ones.)

The prompt injection one is pretty interesting, but still seems to fall under "traditional" plugin security issues: if you authorize a plugin to read everything on your screen, AND have full integration with your email, or whatever, then... that's a huge risk. The AI/injection part makes it triggerable by a third-party, which certainly raises the alarm level a lot, but also: bad idea, period, IMO.

Re: AI browser extensions are a security nightmare

#84
post #2

> Yes, large language models (LLMs) are not actually AI in that they are not actually intelligent, but we’re going to use the common nomenclature here. I'm sorry for the off-topic comment, but why do I keep seeing this? What am I missing here – is it that some people define intelligence as >= human, or that LLM are not intelligence because they're *just* statistical models?

Very clever people have located true intelligence in the gaps between what an machine can do and what a human can. Therefore, to show that you aren’t a starry-eyed rube you put a disclaimer that you aren’t really talking about intelligence, but something that just looks and acts like it. True intelligence is, of course, definitionally the ability to do things like art or… err, wait, sorry, I haven’t checked recently,…

Heh, Computers will never be intelligent, we will just moving the bar until humans can no longer be classified as intelligent.

Re: AI browser extensions are a security nightmare

#85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Very clever people have located true intelligence in the gaps between what an machine can do and what a human can. Therefore, to show that you aren’t a starry-eyed rube you put a disclaimer that you aren’t really talking about intelligence, but something that just looks and acts like it. True intelligence is, of course, definitionally the ability to do things like art or… err, wait, sorry, I haven’t checked recently,…

I’m hesitant to even call this moving the goal posts. Intelligence has never been solidly defined even within humans (see: IQ debate; book smart vs street smart; idiot savants). It’s unsurprising that creating machines that seem to do some stuff very intelligently and some other things not very intelligently at all is causing some discontent with regard to our language. I see a whole lot more gnashing of teeth about…

>So what’s your definition?

I say we take the word intelligence and throw it out the window. It's a bit like talking about the either before we discovered more about physics. We chose a word with an ethereal definition that may or may not apply depending on the context.

So what do we do instead? We define sets of capability and context and devise tests around that. If it turns out a test actually sucked or was not expansive enough, we don't get rid of that particular test. Instead we make a new more advanced test with better coverage. Under this domain no human would pass all the tests either. We could each individual sub test with ratings like 'far below human capability', 'average human capability', 'far beyond human capabilities'. These tests could be everywhere from emotional understanding and comprehension, to reasoning and logical ability, and even include embodiment tests.

Of course even then I see a day where some embodied robot beats the vast majority of emotional, intellectual, and physical tests and some human supremacist still comes back with "iTs n0t InTeLLigeNt"

Re: AI browser extensions are a security nightmare

#86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Very clever people have located true intelligence in the gaps between what an machine can do and what a human can. Therefore, to show that you aren’t a starry-eyed rube you put a disclaimer that you aren’t really talking about intelligence, but something that just looks and acts like it. True intelligence is, of course, definitionally the ability to do things like art or… err, wait, sorry, I haven’t checked recently,…

Stable Diffusion doesnt make art, it makes photos. We can deem them art. Its denoising software.

Ooh, this is a rare one! A comment directly noting the similarities between AI art with photography, but insisting both aren't art. You're in very historical company: https://daily.jstor.org/when-photography-was-not-art/

Re: AI browser extensions are a security nightmare

#87
post #29
post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And if your brain is mostly a statistical model of the world, with action probabilities based on what parts of it happen to be excited at the moment?

How do we know that the brain is a statistical model of the world? It sounds like explaining an unknown phenomenon using the technology du jour - just 10/20 years ago, the brain was a computer.

So conversely, is the brain magic? And if so, if we look at the evolutionary lineage of neural networks, at which point did it become so?

Re: AI browser extensions are a security nightmare

#88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In this examples, it likely took that those companies are often praised about their marketing in the same sentence marketing is mentioned. LLMs don't repeat text its seen before, it links words/tokens/phrases that are related. Its prediction, but the prediction isnt just copypasting a previous webpage. Have you use chatgpt yet? I wouldn't delay. Heck you are here on HN, you basically have a responsibility to test it.

I've used it extensively . GPT4 is great, but it is not intelligent. I think its really weird and also totally understandable that people think it is.

Eh, please comprehensively define intelligent... I have a feeling that this may explain a lot about your answer.

Re: AI browser extensions are a security nightmare

#89
post #54

Actually, aren't all browser extensions a security nightmare? Or has something changed recently?

Yeah parts of the article would still be as valid if this was about regular extensions.

The main difference is that AI extension, by design, send the content of the pages you browse to a server.

A malicious "calculator" extension could also send all the content to a server, and extension users don't really have an idea of what each extension is actually doing.

So skip the "Malware posing as AI browser extension" section, it's same kind of security issues as a malware calculator extension.

The legitimate AI extension's problems are more interesting.

Article wastes a bit more time on other security issues you get from using AI LLM in general. Those apply whether you're using a browser extension or chat.openai.com directly.

The valid point that applies to narrowly AI browser extension are:

1) it could send sensitive data you wouldn't have sent otherwise. Most people would know what they're doing when they explicitly paste the stuff on chat.openai.com. But when it's now automated via the extension DOM scraping, it's a bit harder to realize how much you're giving away.

2) And the hidden text prompt injection. That's interesting as now your attacker could be the website you browse, if you have configured too many plugins (Zapier plugin giving access to your email)

These 2 parts of TFA are imo novel security issues that only exist with AI browser extension, and are interesting.

Re: AI browser extensions are a security nightmare

#90
post #54

Actually, aren't all browser extensions a security nightmare? Or has something changed recently?

Already commented something similar in another thread:

Why is the security policy for extensions still not architected like other web permissions?

There has been a shift on mobile already from "take it or leave it"-style permissions on install towards more fine grained control not overidable by the app manifest.

I think Browser extensions should behave similarly. Especially when it comes to which origins an extensions is allowed to act on.

The user should be able to restrict this regardless of the manifest, even forced to do.

Extensions that need to act on all or an unknown set of origins should require a big and scary prompt after installation, regardless of what the user agrees to during installation.

I say this as a happy user of uBlock origin and React DevTools.

But for the common user the default should be to deny permissions and require user interaction.

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