Kids who get smartphones earlier become adults with worse mental health • Hacker News Board

Re: Kids who get smartphones earlier become adults with worse mental health

#81

Post by jononomo » Mon, May 15, 2023, 2:49 PM UTC

chewbacha wrote: post #75

alexb_ wrote: post #45

There is so much instant dismissal of this entire idea that smartphones are harmful in this thread, most of which is just "correlation is not causation". Yes, correlation does not equal causation. But when it makes logical sense why there would be correlation, there is no way to actually measure causation (we can't exactly give kids placebo phones), we keep seeing the same correlation over and over again, why is it b…

I'm not sure. I think if I rewrote your argument with "social media" instead of "smart phone" it would sound just as convincing.

Smart phones and social media are the same thing.

Re: Kids who get smartphones earlier become adults with worse mental health

#82

Post by Eumenes » Mon, May 15, 2023, 2:51 PM UTC

DUH. The tech/software industry is literally destroying humanity, and will rot the mind of the current generation of children. Most kids wanna be youtubers or influencers. I'm quite frankly embarrassed to be part of it. I cringe when someone asks me what I do. I'd have more pride in digging holes at this point.

We were promised space travel to mars and flying cars, but instead we got hate filled and vain social media, political corruption and manipulation, and so, so much more.

Once shit like Neuralink becomes mainstream, we're going to see a whole ton of people just clock TF out.

Re: Kids who get smartphones earlier become adults with worse mental health

#83

Post by alexb_ » Mon, May 15, 2023, 2:51 PM UTC

chewbacha wrote: post #75

alexb_ wrote: post #45

There is so much instant dismissal of this entire idea that smartphones are harmful in this thread, most of which is just "correlation is not causation". Yes, correlation does not equal causation. But when it makes logical sense why there would be correlation, there is no way to actually measure causation (we can't exactly give kids placebo phones), we keep seeing the same correlation over and over again, why is it b…

I'm not sure. I think if I rewrote your argument with "social media" instead of "smart phone" it would sound just as convincing.

Smart phones give complete access to social media at literally every single waking hour. They are practically one and the same.

Re: Kids who get smartphones earlier become adults with worse mental health

#84

Post by makeitdouble » Mon, May 15, 2023, 2:51 PM UTC

23B1 wrote: post #24

This is one of those obvious correlations that for some reason everyone needs to question. It's not the cellphone itself that's the problem, it's the addictive content readily accessible therein. I'm no luddite, but it's pretty obvious that humans aren't meant to be bent over little black rectangles all day, addicted to our own insecurities.

By that token, humans weren't meant to get medical procedures on chronical illnesses and live up to 100+ years.

What humans were meant to doesn't really help, and what long lasting impacts smart phone will have is pretty much up for debate.

My view on this is, we have natural defense + evolutionary mechanisms to deal with potential exctintion events. If you really want to look at the issue at such a basic level, tell me how the human race will be decimated via the arrival of smart phones.

Re: Kids who get smartphones earlier become adults with worse mental health

#85

Post by noisy_boy » Mon, May 15, 2023, 2:52 PM UTC

DrThunder wrote: post #10

Yeah, I'm not giving my daughter a smart phone or tablet. She might be a weird outcast but oh well, it's not worth the possible damage to her mental health. I think in few decades we'll look back at this generation of parents who just shoved smart devices in their kids hands with no filter akin to handing kids cigarettes. It turns them into sociopaths. I have some younger Gen Z cousins and it's just weird to watch th…

I don't think kids will be outcast just because they don't own a smartphone. Based on what I can see around my own circle, most kids have 2 or 3 "close" friends with rest being mostly varied degrees of acquaintances. Those friendships usually start one-on-one - maybe there will be some sly smiles and minor jibes/comments about the phone situation initially but then like everything else, people take it into the stride and both parties adjust to the "difficulties" pretty quickly and figure out workarounds within the limitation (or they don't and the friendship doesn't carry forward). Eventually the close circle forms where everyone has come to terms with the rough edges of everyone else. Like that one friend in the circle who doesn't have a smartphone.

Also, providing "low-intensity" options like dumbphones just for messages/calling and laptops with age/time-restriction etc helps significantly.

Re: Kids who get smartphones earlier become adults with worse mental health

#86

Post by Eumenes » Mon, May 15, 2023, 2:53 PM UTC

DrThunder wrote: post #10

Yeah, I'm not giving my daughter a smart phone or tablet. She might be a weird outcast but oh well, it's not worth the possible damage to her mental health. I think in few decades we'll look back at this generation of parents who just shoved smart devices in their kids hands with no filter akin to handing kids cigarettes. It turns them into sociopaths. I have some younger Gen Z cousins and it's just weird to watch th…

Weird is in the eye of the beholder and most people suck and are dumb, so good on you.

Re: Kids who get smartphones earlier become adults with worse mental health

#87

Post by naravara » Mon, May 15, 2023, 2:53 PM UTC

IceHegel wrote: post #40

23B1 wrote: post #24

This is one of those obvious correlations that for some reason everyone needs to question. It's not the cellphone itself that's the problem, it's the addictive content readily accessible therein. I'm no luddite, but it's pretty obvious that humans aren't meant to be bent over little black rectangles all day, addicted to our own insecurities.

There was a period of time from about 2011-2013 where it felt like many parents would complain about everyone being on their phone. Then they started using them too and stopped complaining.

If anything parents are as bad or worse than the kids now.

I'm about 40 and am constantly having to remind my own parents to put the phone away and be more present with their grandkids when they come to visit.

Re: Kids who get smartphones earlier become adults with worse mental health

#88

Post by nashashmi » Mon, May 15, 2023, 2:53 PM UTC

Every child needs guardrails before they are given extra, extra features. This article seems to stress that point. The title is just hype.

Lots of people are commenting here without reading the article.

Edit: the main line here is

> We cannot be certain that the correlations shown in the data are evidence of causality

Re: Kids who get smartphones earlier become adults with worse mental health

#89

Post by [deleted] » Mon, May 15, 2023, 2:53 PM UTC

alexb_ wrote: post #45

There is so much instant dismissal of this entire idea that smartphones are harmful in this thread, most of which is just "correlation is not causation". Yes, correlation does not equal causation. But when it makes logical sense why there would be correlation, there is no way to actually measure causation (we can't exactly give kids placebo phones), we keep seeing the same correlation over and over again, why is it b…

[deleted]

Re: Kids who get smartphones earlier become adults with worse mental health

#90

Post by thatwasunusual » Mon, May 15, 2023, 2:54 PM UTC

alexb_ wrote: post #45

There is so much instant dismissal of this entire idea that smartphones are harmful in this thread, most of which is just "correlation is not causation". Yes, correlation does not equal causation. But when it makes logical sense why there would be correlation, there is no way to actually measure causation (we can't exactly give kids placebo phones), we keep seeing the same correlation over and over again, why is it b…

I heard about the term "cognitive overload" a few years ago. Just google it if you want to; following the Wikipedia article about "Cognitive load" leads to two _very_ interesting articles:

* Social facilitation

* Drive theory

I think these two - in particular - describes in detail what you are describing. It's scary as hell, for sure; I have a 4-5 year old daughter myself, and I do _not_ want her to live with the expose of "what everything is about" before she is old enough to handle it.