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When “free forever” means “free for the next 4 months”

blog.zulip.com

81–90 of 267 posts

Re: When “free forever” means “free for the next 4 months”

#81
post #53
post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Consideration doesn't have to be money. Facebook doesn't charge you money and nevertheless has enforceable contracts.

what contract terms can you enforce against Facebook?

For example, Facebook has been sued multiple times for breaking terms in which they promised not to provide data to third parties without your consent.

Re: When “free forever” means “free for the next 4 months”

#82
post #73

If a company gets rid of my free forever plan with them, there is a 0% chance that they're getting any money or positive word of mouth from me in the future. It's incredibly scummy behavior. If you're not willing to actually offer it forever, just call it a free plan instead of lying about it.

doesn't seem like much of a loss to lose that "business":

a user who hops from free service to free service, and is so opposed to spending money that they will badmouth any business that wants to actually charge for its service.

Re: When “free forever” means “free for the next 4 months”

#83
post #77
post #73

If a company gets rid of my free forever plan with them, there is a 0% chance that they're getting any money or positive word of mouth from me in the future. It's incredibly scummy behavior. If you're not willing to actually offer it forever, just call it a free plan instead of lying about it.

Not trying to be funny, but if you're on a 'free forever' plan and happy with it there's already a close-to-0% chance they'll get any money off you...

I have had my company purchase company plans for products I use as free or free for personal use.

I will never recommend Google Apps for Domains or whatever it is called now after they dicked around.

Re: When “free forever” means “free for the next 4 months”

#84
post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not sure I totally agree. Capitalizing on a competitors mistake is kind of slimy; calling out their poor business practices is not. Users will invest their time and resources into using your product based on the promise that it’s free forever. Changing your mind later puts the burden on them to figure out how to move forward. Even if I was a free user and I was considering a paid plan that type of dishonesty would ma…

They should at least grandfathered any users on the -free forever- plan

Or tell them it may stop being free in X years, where X is large enough that it’s aways off but close enough that some decide to switch. And then stop new signups but never actually take away the free plan.

The “good work Wesley, I’ll probably charge you in the morning” plan.

Re: When “free forever” means “free for the next 4 months”

#85
post #66
post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I feel like if its 2023 and you're still gullible enough to fall for "free forever" bait and switch offerings from cloud providers then we need to have a frank discussion on neofeudalist late stage capitalism where a mainstay of its many successes in the digital realm is to literally trick you into consuming a product and pretend like it never happened.

Neofeudalist late stage capitalism would have let boomers continue to have “free forever” plans while prices increased for everyone younger.

Boomers eventually die, or forget their pssword.

Re: When “free forever” means “free for the next 4 months”

#86
Their problem is they went with the 'forever' word instead of the much more common 'lifetime' word. That way they can tell you that even though you might have thought it was your lifetime they were talking about; in reality they were talking about the lifetime of something completely different.

Re: When “free forever” means “free for the next 4 months”

#87
post #82
post #73

If a company gets rid of my free forever plan with them, there is a 0% chance that they're getting any money or positive word of mouth from me in the future. It's incredibly scummy behavior. If you're not willing to actually offer it forever, just call it a free plan instead of lying about it.

doesn't seem like much of a loss to lose that "business": a user who hops from free service to free service, and is so opposed to spending money that they will badmouth any business that wants to actually charge for its service.

But I will not become a customer either. Bystanders and witnesses are all potential customers.

Re: When “free forever” means “free for the next 4 months”

#88
post #53
post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Consideration doesn't have to be money. Facebook doesn't charge you money and nevertheless has enforceable contracts.

what contract terms can you enforce against Facebook?

Depends on your jurisdiction. In Germany, for example, a court has recognized that Facebook enters in a contractual relationship with you when you register on the platform. As such, Facebook agrees to store and let you access your information on the platform in exchange for the permission to use that data for its own purposes. The highest court in Germany (BGH) confirmed this in a court case that Facebook lost where parents were denied full access to the Facebook account of their deceased daughter (they were only allowed to view the memorialized profile but not log in and read the chat messages, for example). The court found that the parents rightfully inherited the contractual relationship with Facebook in its entirety and as such had to be given access to the data that Facebook agreed to store and make accessible to its user.

Full ruling available here (in German):

LG Berlin https://openjur.de/u/870262.html, which was appealed by Facebook and then went to the BGH (highest court) which ruled in favour of the parents: https://openjur.de/u/2110135.html

Edit: Added links and distinctions between the different courts at the end.

Re: When “free forever” means “free for the next 4 months”

#89
post #73

If a company gets rid of my free forever plan with them, there is a 0% chance that they're getting any money or positive word of mouth from me in the future. It's incredibly scummy behavior. If you're not willing to actually offer it forever, just call it a free plan instead of lying about it.

you’ve never made a mistake in your future predictions? youve never committed to something you couldnt deliver?

i understand the outrage but remember the people on the other side of that screen are just humans too. many things dont turn out the way the initial intention was (im not excusing this specific instance, im just hoping for less vitriol when i someday make some over promising mistake in future). let he who is without sin…

Re: When “free forever” means “free for the next 4 months”

#90
post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not sure I totally agree. Capitalizing on a competitors mistake is kind of slimy; calling out their poor business practices is not. Users will invest their time and resources into using your product based on the promise that it’s free forever. Changing your mind later puts the burden on them to figure out how to move forward. Even if I was a free user and I was considering a paid plan that type of dishonesty would ma…

>Users will invest their time and resources into using your product based on the promise that it’s free forever. Unless you're a naive new entrant into the real world who doesn't know better, it's on you if you're fooled into thinking something is "free forever". There is no such thing as a free lunch.

Totally agree. In fact for myself, if a company is offering a free service, especially one that has significant cost on their end (bandwidth, compute, and storage are common cases), it's somewhat of a red flag to me. Too many things in tech have been "free" only to discover years later the negative consequences either for their business (which is ultimately bad for me as a user) or for society as a whole (which is also bad for me as a member of society). I much prefer transparent and sustainable business models that aren't based on some handwavy explanation that the free users will somehow lead to a bunch of paid users and that's how they'll make money Soon.
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