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What it’s like to fall into the deadly Australian plant, gympie-gympie

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Re: What it’s like to fall into the deadly Australian plant, gympie-gympie

#81

Post by Arrath »

moron4hire wrote: post #32
llamaLord wrote: post #7

There's an urban legend in Australia about a bloke that went camping once, had to take a shit in the bush, and didn't have any dunny-role. Poor guy grabbed a handful of Gympie-gympie that was on the ground next to him and proceeded to wipe his ass with it. Legend says he ended up topping himself a few hours later to escape the pain. Whether it's true or not... Fuck only knows. We do like making shit up... Especially…

We have the same urban legend in the US about poison ivy, but I actually knew a kid who made the mistake. Poison ivy is certainly nowhere near this description of gympie-gympie, but the persistent itch is certainly unrelenting enough to cause pretty severe distress. I got a small touch of it on my forearm one time. Didn't even know I had brushed up against the plant, so I didn't perform the recommended clean up. Just…

It select parts of the States/Canada you might also reach for Devil's Club, which would be a huge mistake.

Re: What it’s like to fall into the deadly Australian plant, gympie-gympie

#82

Post by hilbert42 »

eutropia wrote: post #47
foobarian wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I was also lucky in another respect in that the local advised me to wear long pants and a long-sleeved shirt Just based on Australia's reputation alone I don't think I would ever even think about venturing outside in anything short of a hazmat suit on top of a suit of plate mail :-)

Made a mess from bursting into laughter from this. Cheers

Ages ago, I got a similar reaction (and also the exact opposite) when I posted my encounters with these critters (can't remember if on HN or elsewhere):

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Redback_spider

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Australian_funnel-web_spider,

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atrax

One of my staff had lots of Atrax robustus in his backyard and over a period he brought several to work and they became the Electronics Department's 'pet' (but we only kept one at a time).

We put him (with A. robustus the males are more deadly and agressive than the females) in a large empty coffee jar with rocks and dirt filling about a third the jar and with air holes in the lid which were just big enough to fit a pencil through. We kept him fed on slaters (woodlice) and crickets and he took pride of place on my office desk. Typically, they'd live for 18 months to two years.

They were talking points for visitors to my office (some were horried but most just curious). When I'd come in of a morning and switch the lights on he'd rear up on his hind legs with fangs thrust out. I'd occasionally respond by sticking one of those red 'Copperplate' pencils though an air hole and he'd attack it. The venom could be clearly seen running down the outside of the pencil. I kept that badly pocked-marked pencil as a souvenir for some years but unfortunately I've since lost it.

Also, I was 'lucky' enough to have the organization's union rep as one of my staff. Often, he'd come into my office for a discussion and he'd jokingly preface our convention to the effect 'We expect your cooperation in this matter or we'll let him loose when you're not looking.'

For some reason, that post horrified several UK readers.

:-)

Re: What it’s like to fall into the deadly Australian plant, gympie-gympie

#83

Post by aidenn0 »

hilbert42 wrote: post #78
aidenn0 wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Deadliest venomous creature in Australia is the honeybee.

Uh, where did you get that notion from?

Multiple deaths per year in Australia from honeybee stings. Box jellyfish average less than one per year. Conflicting sources put bees (or bees and wasps together) at just behind, on par with, or ahead of venomous snakes in terms of mean annual deaths in Australia.

Re: What it’s like to fall into the deadly Australian plant, gympie-gympie

#84

Post by dopylitty »

photochemsyn wrote: post #23

Recent research (2020) revealed these plants containt a potent protein neurotoxin: https://www.science.org/doi/10.1126/sciadv.abb8828 > "We show here that the venoms of Australian Dendrocnide species contain heretofore unknown pain-inducing peptides that potently activate mouse sensory neurons and delay inactivation of voltage-gated sodium channels. These neurotoxins localize specifically to the stinging hairs and ar…

I wonder if you could whip up a vaccine to generate antibodies against a part of the protein so that it can’t bind to the right places on the sensory neurons.

Or heck maybe skip the vaccine and create some monoclonals against it. Although my understanding is that creating monoclonals usually requires isolating B cells targeting the right epitope from someone and sequencing them so some unlucky donor human or animal would need to touch the plant first.

Re: What it’s like to fall into the deadly Australian plant, gympie-gympie

#85

Post by hilbert42 »

aidenn0 wrote: post #83
hilbert42 wrote: post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Uh, where did you get that notion from?

Multiple deaths per year in Australia from honeybee stings. Box jellyfish average less than one per year. Conflicting sources put bees (or bees and wasps together) at just behind, on par with, or ahead of venomous snakes in terms of mean annual deaths in Australia.

…But also honeybees are not natives. As I've said below, most of us survive despite some frightening encounters.

Re: What it’s like to fall into the deadly Australian plant, gympie-gympie

#86

Post by nirav72 »

llamaLord wrote: post #8
coldcode wrote: post #6

Stories like this make me wonder why anyone lives in Australia, since virtually everything seems to want to kill you. Or perhaps Aussies are tougher than the rest of us.

To be fair... There are at least... 3... Animals here that aren't explicitly trying to kill us. It's really not that bad. Just don't go into the warm water or the box jellyfish will get you. Keep an eye out for Sting-rays too... Nobody wants to go out like old-mate Steve. Oh and don't go into the cold water either, blue-ringed octopus... Nasty buggers. Rivers too... Not a great idea... Crocks are pretty nippy when th…

Don’t forget the dangerous snails.

https://www.jcu.edu.au/this-is-uni/natural-and-built-environ...

Re: What it’s like to fall into the deadly Australian plant, gympie-gympie

#87

Post by fuzzfactor »

giraffe_lady wrote: post #15
llamaLord wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The US has bears and mountain lions and shit, which are legitimately pretty dangerous. That being said, they never lost a war against their wildlife...

Kudzu has entered the chat.

Florida pythons do not even need a strategy either.

Re: What it’s like to fall into the deadly Australian plant, gympie-gympie

#88

Post by P_I_Staker »

tomhoward wrote: post #11
coldcode wrote: post #6

Stories like this make me wonder why anyone lives in Australia, since virtually everything seems to want to kill you. Or perhaps Aussies are tougher than the rest of us.

It's often said, but really, the way it's reported in international media is very sensationalist; the things that are deadly are just not common in areas where people live and travel. Yes, sure, we have some deadly snakes, spiders, crocodiles, a few plants like in the OP, etc. But so do many other countries/regions around the world, including the USA. In practice, the vast majority of Australians never have any conta…

Worth pointing out that short of brown bears and wolves, the stuff we have in the US is pretty tame.

Going from memory, feel free to correct: - Tons of snakes that will ruin your day (and probably week/month), but most of them have high survival rates and anti-venom. I was shocked to find they're often survivable without treatment? We're running out of anti-venom for coral snakes (interestingly they're basically cobras), but they're famously docile and have a weak bite.

    - Two dangerous spiders, but both fairly treatable with medical attention. Though brown recluse bites that progress can be pretty scary

    - Alligators are surprisingly non-dangerous, if not fed, or intentionally interacted with. They'll walk right past you, and want nothing to do with people

    - Big cats aren't too common and tend to avoid people; but I guess they've been seeing a few more attacks out west
So it's mostly just bears. Actually, contrary to popular knowledge, black bears kill quite a few people. They can become predatory. Brown bears are obviously scary. I think it's also a myth that you should always play dead... you have to really understand bear behavior to know what to do.

Australia has crocs that seriously hunt people, and fight them over territory. Plus snakes that are super deadly. I guess almost all venomous spiders are less of a big deal than I was lead to believe growing up and usually not fatal, even without medical attention... but you wouldn't want to get bit by a funnel web.

Re: What it’s like to fall into the deadly Australian plant, gympie-gympie

#89

Post by hilbert42 »

photochemsyn wrote: post #23

Recent research (2020) revealed these plants containt a potent protein neurotoxin: https://www.science.org/doi/10.1126/sciadv.abb8828 > "We show here that the venoms of Australian Dendrocnide species contain heretofore unknown pain-inducing peptides that potently activate mouse sensory neurons and delay inactivation of voltage-gated sodium channels. These neurotoxins localize specifically to the stinging hairs and ar…

Thanks very much for that most interesting reference. (I'm sure I'd have seen it earlier if I'd not let my sub to Science expire.)

"These irritation-inducing molecules include histamine, acetylcholine, 5-hydroxytryptamine as well as formic acid and other low–molecular weight organic acids."

Having been stung by bull-ants and like brethren, I can attest that as bad and as painful as these formic acid/concoction-type stings were they pail against what I experienced from Gympie-Gympie.

"…none of these small molecules in the volar forearm of humans was entirely sufficient to reproduce the symptoms of a Dendrocnide sting,"

That is also fully consistent with my experience.

What I find so interesting about this paper (in addition to my interest through experience), is that these are newly discovered toxins which seems somewhat strange given the ubiquity of Gympie-Gympie and its well-known ability to inflict excruciating pain.

Presumably, this discovery will spur on further toxins research.

Re: What it’s like to fall into the deadly Australian plant, gympie-gympie

#90

Post by llamaLord »

hilbert42 wrote: post #74
foobarian wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I was also lucky in another respect in that the local advised me to wear long pants and a long-sleeved shirt Just based on Australia's reputation alone I don't think I would ever even think about venturing outside in anything short of a hazmat suit on top of a suit of plate mail :-)

Ha! I don't want mislead you, in that I'm also a 'local' albeit from several thousand kilometers south of Cape Tribulation (Australia is a very big place). Thus, I'm familiar with much of the flora and fauna that seems to terrify people from other parts of the world (it's just that this was my first visit to these parts). The Emmagen Creek 'local' was someone who I already knew, he used to work for me in electronics…

You don't know what "innate reflexes" are until you encounter one of these bastards, or a Tiger Snake (what we had in Tassie).

Something significantly lower down the brain stem kicks in and you react before your conscious brain even realises what's going on.

It's actually kinda fascinating to experience because you can tell our fear of snakes isn't something "learned"... It's baked into the hardware by evolution somewhere down in that pre-human part of the brain.

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