Live data from Hacker News

Duolingo Max, a learning experience powered by GPT-4

blog.duolingo.com

81–90 of 250 posts

Re: Duolingo Max, a learning experience powered by GPT-4

#81
post #10

Just take a look at how poorly the bot does for Spanish: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=35155577

The request is weird and doesn't have much to do with language learning, though. It messed up with rhymes, but I don't think Duolingo has anything similar.

Like, who on Earth, if learning a language (and not just needing a phrasebook) would ever want to remember foreign language words by rhyming them with a different language?

While truly etymologically related words make sense - such as "escribir" and "scribe", connecting unrelated words is IMHO a bad idea that would do more harm than good.

I currently try learn some Spanish and I had some trouble with Spanish "mirar" accidentally being close enough to Japanese "見る" (which absolutely aren't related, of course, just happen sound similar), so now and then my brain had farted ("hey, I'm speaking in a third language, other than my native and English!") and I could blurt out "miro!" instead of "mira!" or some similarly weird shit unintentionally mixing up two different grammar systems as my brain struggles to explain itself through the grammar I know about. Maybe it's just me, but I think unrelated rhymes and false cognates are a big no-no when learning a new language.

When I've asked ChatGPT (GPT-3.5) to explain me Spanish grammar, such as "explain me 'a' in the beginning of 'a tu hermano le gusta...') it did a decent job explaining me how it works. Factually it matched what I found later, cross-checking.

Re: Duolingo Max, a learning experience powered by GPT-4

#82
With GPT-4, I'm thinking if Duolingo has fundamentally been reduced to a game.

The key network effect left is pretty much a leaderboard that fuels their daily retention. So any existing game company could potentially create another gamified learning app as part of their game pools.

Re: Duolingo Max, a learning experience powered by GPT-4

#83

Would love to use duolingo, but they have no interest in supporting iranian languages. I’ve never really seen a clear answer for why. They have about 200 million native speakers worldwide. Persian, Pashto, Kurdish are the largest.

If I had to guess, I would say it's probably something like not enough demand from non-Iranian speakers to learn Iranian languages.

Re: Duolingo Max, a learning experience powered by GPT-4

#84
post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What is wrong with the example? Although I am not a Spanish speaker, naively it looks fine. The pronunciations written in English are very impressive and do indeed sound somewhat like the corresponding Spanish words (albeit of course incorrect! But most people don't know IPA).

No, it's absolutely terrible on every single one. For some reason it's telling you how to pronouce them with an English accent, or rather how an English-speaking person would pronounce it if they didn't speak Spanish at all. > Adiós: "Adiós, my toes" - rhymes with "toes" In this example "toss" would be much closer than "toes". But yeah, this is awful. I don't know how this happened.

you must pronounce “toss” differently than most english speakers

Re: Duolingo Max, a learning experience powered by GPT-4

#85

Why only iOS?

Duolingo seems like they have separate teams for iOS, Android and Web.

Their iOS team seems to be the one who experiment the most with new features, and then they either get discarded or finally make it to Android, and then in a few years to the Web.

It is really annoying, as when I used Duolingo (stopped because of the new update in Jan), I would often use all three platforms, and have the worst experience.

Re: Duolingo Max, a learning experience powered by GPT-4

#86
Ugh. You can just feel the management layers in this.

Management wants to do something with AI. It's so hot right now. Your product guy got an idea for a cool new feature. Tests show that users actually like it. It's helpful. Great.

But now you need to explain how you made Duolingo money. First idea, your product has a paid tier, add it as a feature to the paid tier too boost paid user retention and new signups. Great, metrics! But you're pretty sure that, while customers do like this when you ask, you're probably not moving the needle. What to do? Well, you're a mobile game company, focus on what always works: go after the whales.

Now your product is an exclusive EVEN HIGHER tier. Get the art guy to make, like, an Amex Black Card but for the Owl. Make him do a superhero landing or something. Run a bunch of ads at the paid users to convince them that they'd totally be helped by this. They'll be focused on the users who already pay Duolingo money, so those are perfect advertising targets. And you'll be able to show real dollars that your feature is pulling in. Hooray! That VP spot is as good as yours, I bet!

Re: Duolingo Max, a learning experience powered by GPT-4

#87
post #71

I’ve got a trip to Spain in 4 months. I know a few spanish words now, but nothing beyond that. Will Duolingo get me to some level of being able to muddle my way through conversations (assuming the other person knows I’m a tourist and is using small words) in that timeframe?

Depending on how much time you're willing to put in, it can help a lot. 15-30 minutes twice a day would be a good start.

Re: Duolingo Max, a learning experience powered by GPT-4

#88
post #37

I've been successfully using ChatGPT for learning German in the last month or so. It does a great job enriching my plain B1 level sentences with some fancy verbs or adjectives and pointing out my mistakes.

How does that work? Do you just tell it that you are learning and to correct your mistakes, then converse with it in German? Does it infer your German level from your own chats with it?

Yes, you can tell it that you are learning the language at the beginning of the conversation in plain English and ask it to correct any mistakes. You can easily start a bilingual conversation with ChatGPT, some random example here: https://www.reddit.com/r/russian/comments/112xgp2/practicing...

To show you what I meant when I mentioned "enriching sentences", I've just generated an example of a B1-level English sentence improved by ChatGPT.

User: Please improve this sentence: "Many people want to learn languages because they like to travel"

ChatGPT: "Learning languages is a popular pursuit because it enables people to travel and explore different cultures with greater ease."

It works similarly with other languages.

As for my German level, it wasn't evaluated by ChatGPT but by an external assessment exam and I only mentioned it to add some more context to the story. Frankly, I probably wouldn't trust ChatGPT's assessment in this regard.

Re: Duolingo Max, a learning experience powered by GPT-4

#89

I have severely mixed feelings about Duolingo. I can't imagine paying more than I already do for the "Super" option. If you're trying to learn Spanish or French, it seems like a pretty full-featured app. Unfortunately, I'm trying to learn Greek and every aspect of it is sub-par compared to other languages. It doesn't even read you questions correctly. (It uses flat intonation as if it's saying a statement.) There are…

Oh, I see the Greek course has gotten worse.

Before the UX update at the end of last year, I was trying Arabic (something like 2 years of daily lessons and I still couldn't manage the alphabet), Greek (felt worse than before the preceding UX change but I couldn't say why exactly), Esperanto (the audio sounded like it was done by a volunteer at their own home?), Dutch, German, and Spanish.

I'm still doing German, because I live here now, but I gave up on all the rest the day that update happened.

Oh my goodness the voices and animations are annoying. Whenever the young boy appears I have to mute my speakers.

I'm sure they're hyper-focused on "engagement metrics" to the detriment of all else, just like how old-school OK Cupid turned into just another Tinder clone.

Re: Duolingo Max, a learning experience powered by GPT-4

#90

Does it actually say how much Duolingo Max would cost? I do not see anything in that article or on their website. I don't have the app, maybe it's already live and pricing is available there. I deleted Duolingo years ago when it felt like I knew everything it had to teach me, but was still far from fluent in the language. I assume it's gotten better, and would consider trying this new feature.

It doesn't. Neither does the website.

An article from Yahoo [0] says it's "$29.99 per month or $167.99 per year", but they don't link to a source.

[0] - https://au.finance.yahoo.com/news/duolingo-launches-subscrip...

Post reply on HN