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Caffeine and Exercise Performance

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Re: Caffeine and Exercise Performance

#81

Post by mindslight »

boveus wrote: post #69

It is difficult to determine if researchers are measuring the effect of caffeine itself or the effect of individuals taking caffeine to recover from the effects of caffeine withdrawal. This is a common weakness in studies that show purported benefits to caffeine consumption[1,2,3]. Anecdotally as someone who quit caffeine entirely about a year ago, the effects of caffeine withdrawal seemed to last much longer than th…

24 hours, seriously? In my experience from quitting caffeine cold turkey many times, caffeine detox takes 2-3 weeks. The first 24 hours is relatively easy, on days 2-3 the headache and extreme lethargy really sets in. The worst clears up in 7-10 days.

I think the only meaningful way to run the study is to compare people who are completely free of caffeine, versus people who are steady state a certain level of caffeine per day. Either two different groups, or the same group separated by a month.

This research assumption is right in line with how society ignores caffeine as a non-drug. When asked what drugs I'm taking, I've told doctors things like "500mg caffeine" and they looked at me like I had two heads. Or my aunt who has trouble sleeping to the point of being prescribed benzos, but still has coffee at 5PM. Apparently it's all just "drinking coffee" and not doing a psychoactive drug, because "drugs" are "bad".

Re: Caffeine and Exercise Performance

#82

Post by hammock »

talove wrote: post #78

I drink one cup of pour-over coffee that I make every morning. I like it medium to medium strong. I perceive many physical effects from it. At this point it's my morning ritual. 20 minutes in bed or on the sofa reading or doing a crossword while drinking a coffee. I am also an hobbyist endurance cyclist. I do cycling 'events' that last as long as 12+ hours. And average somewhere between 6-8. While I've tried for year…

Coke*, one hopes

Re: Caffeine and Exercise Performance

#83

Post by lostlogin »

kick_in_the_dor wrote: post #73
brightball wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I switched to half-caff coffee and don't personally experience caffeine withdrawal anymore when I go without. I think it weened me off the need. I still drink it in the morning just because I enjoy it.

Nice, i should try that out. Is half-caff decaf, or is it a third class?

I have no idea, but you can buy coffees that are lower caffeine varieties. Robusta isn’t generally great tasting but generally has a lot of caffeine and is added to blends for this reason (and because it’s cheap).

Trying full strength but low caffeine varieties might be a nice option.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Low_caffeine_coffee

Re: Caffeine and Exercise Performance

#84

Post by hammock »

kick_in_the_dor wrote: post #68
tomalaci wrote: post #19

Caffeine combined with L-Theanine does seem provide slight boost for focus to me. That said, I think biggest mood/focus/energy difference (besides a nice workout which is also important) for me was getting vitamins and other micronutrients in order. I highly suggest you to do a blood test or two per year for all the common vitamins/micronutrients to see which you need to fix. For men, I think it is especially importa…

What do you use for micronutrients? I recently started using a Green Powder, and I think I'm getting great results, but they are quite expensive...

On the cheap you can take a random ZMA and Vit D supps.

For full multivitamin, I recommend Thorne, which uses the most bioavailable chelated versions of vitamins and minerals. Once you learn how in-bioavailable the vast majority of ingredients in a standard MV are, you will feel sad

Re: Caffeine and Exercise Performance

#85

Post by lostlogin »

jack_pp wrote: post #44
pmontra wrote: post #27

One data point: I can drink 3 espressos at midnight, go to bed and fall asleep. Apparently I'm immune to caffeine which is both good (I can have a coffee at any time of the day) and bad (if I'm sleepy and I have to drive a coffee won't wake me up.) Maybe I also won't get any of those exercise performance effects.

have you tried modafinil? might not be the best solution for long drives except if you plan well ahead, like say if you have a late 4h drive after which you will sleep maybe take modafinil 6-7h before the drive so you can actually sleep when it's over

Modafinil might make you smarter too.

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/16140369/

Re: Caffeine and Exercise Performance

#86

Post by yamtaddle »

pmontra wrote: post #27

One data point: I can drink 3 espressos at midnight, go to bed and fall asleep. Apparently I'm immune to caffeine which is both good (I can have a coffee at any time of the day) and bad (if I'm sleepy and I have to drive a coffee won't wake me up.) Maybe I also won't get any of those exercise performance effects.

There are genes associated with very high levels of caffeine tolerance. Could be that.

Re: Caffeine and Exercise Performance

#87

Post by boringg »

lostlogin wrote: post #79
gumby wrote: post #74

I have long been fascinated by the degree to which WWII was fought on caffeine and nicotine (on all sides and all theatres). Other drugs (e.g. amphetamine and Benzedrine) get some press but we’re minor factors. I did a few experiments decades ago with nicotine, enough to notice its nice resonant behavior with coffee, but not enough I guess to notice any real benefit myself. I did relish the social habits associated w…

Regarding your WW2 comment a Reading Spike Milligan and his descriptions of making tea under fire is excellent. But as for coffee just being a habit, no way. I’m not sure how you did it so cleanly, but the headaches on stopping can be terrible.

Agreed caffeine withdrawal is real you don't switch off that habit with meaningful consequences on your body. However maybe tea has been covering the caffeine component and they slowly tapered off.

Additionally apparently having coffee first thing in the morning, your body gets adjusted to that and your brain gets dependent on coffee to get a quick start.

Re: Caffeine and Exercise Performance

#88

Post by AtlasBarfed »

As a former Ironman distance triathlete anywhere from 11 to 16 hours of completion time, caffiene on race day is a pillar of maintaining both mental and physical sustained exertion.

In Ironman France, which effectively has a Tour De France category 1 climb of 12 miles up a mountain, I got sleepy at the top of the climb, to the point I wanted to take a nap. Yes, you can get sleepy during an ironman.

I has heard 1-2%, 2-4% was greater than I thought. If that is true, no endurance athlete is competitive at the top levels without doing caffeine, so it's almost guaranteed every olympic athlete does caffeine.

Re: Caffeine and Exercise Performance

#89

Post by sph »

datacruncher01 wrote: post #65
sph wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am diagnosed with ADHD and ultra sensitive to caffeine. A can of coke at 8pm and I'm awake till 2am. A cup of homebrew coffee and it's 50/50 if it's gonna make me anxious all day. Definitely jittery and faster heart rate. Conversely, amphetamine relaxes me, lowers my blood pressure and my pulse rate by 15 bpm. Though I am very aware it would not let me sleep if I tried to. (I do not mix the two. I was a daily two c…

Indeed, not everyone with ADHD is going to have the same reaction to caffeine so it may not be the strongest correlation. I did look into it in the past and for a number of people with ADHD it has an opposite effect of what it does for other people. For those folks, it won't give them a burst of energy unless they drink a lot of coffee and a smaller amount can conversely calm them down. Caffeine works through a separ…

> it won't give them a burst of energy unless they drink a lot of coffee and a smaller amount can conversely calm them down

That might just be addiction? Nicotine relaxes smokers, but because they're in withdrawal when they do not smoke.

Re: Caffeine and Exercise Performance

#90

Post by pelasaco »

patpatpat wrote: post #36
pelasaco wrote: post #28

being an old bjj black belt (4th degree), I loved to see it here. I'm training bjj/grappling for more than 30 years right now. I'm 40, and started it when I was 10. I did the math and I drink around 6mg-8mg/kg/day. My question is regarding the caffeine tolerance. Should I reset it from time to time? Never did it, but I'm curious if it exists and its necessary or if that's just a myth. OSS

You can definitely cycle caffeine. If you want to experience that amazing caffeine high. There is also some guidance that you should give it 3-4 hours after waking to have your first coffee, as it gives your natural cortisol a chance to do it's thing (caffeine supposedly uses similar mechanisms and blocks your cortisol).

doing wrong probably my whole life.. the first coffee, comes always literally 5 minutes after waking up. Wake up, walk to the kitchen, drink water while brewing coffee, start the day, repeat.
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