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Hacking the PS4 / PS5 Through the PS2 Emulator

cturt.github.io

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Re: Hacking the PS4 / PS5 Through the PS2 Emulator

#81

Post by Cyph0n »

boltzmann-brain wrote: post #75
morsch wrote: post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

About 130 of 160 million PS2s were sold in North America, Europe and Japan. Developing countries don't appear to be a significant market for the console. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/PlayStation_2_sales

This is heavily skewed. If you lived in Eastern Europe it was customary to drive down to Germany to buy PS1/2 because they were much cheaper there. I know several people who started their retail business just by bringing back car loads of PS2's. One guy even got a mocking nickname (something like "playstation") that stuck with him for decades after when he moved on to selling HiFi and AV out of his store. I absolutel…

Yep, it was the same in the Middle East. Immigrants and travelers to Europe and the US frequently brought back electronics, including game consoles. They were then modchipped locally.

Re: Hacking the PS4 / PS5 Through the PS2 Emulator

#82

Post by themoonisachees »

wereHamster wrote: post #70

> by proxying PSN traffic (which is just HTTP, instead of HTTPS for server-side cost saving reasons). Lol who uses that argument in 2022? TLS cost is a rounding error with current generation of hardware.

I would imagine doing tls for millions of ps5s worldwide would register a blip, but it seems bonkers that psn is still using http. Maybe that's how it got hacked so much

Re: Hacking the PS4 / PS5 Through the PS2 Emulator

#83

Post by lostgame »

p1necone wrote: post #49
lostgame wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The reason the PS2 succeeded so massively is that it was an affordable DVD player alone , IIRC at the time you could buy a DVD player for like $199 or a PS2 for $299. It was a no brainer for any family looking to either replace their console or seek to upgrade to DVD - something which was a way bigger deal than the transition from DVD to Blu-Ray.

Similarly I believe the PS3 was the cheapest blu ray player on the market on release too.

If I remember correctly at the time, the difference was about $100. It was a no-brainer

I still say if SEGA went DVD with the Dreamcast we'd have a totally different console scene, but I'm also a huge SEGA fangirl, so what can I say.

Re: Hacking the PS4 / PS5 Through the PS2 Emulator

#84

Post by jonny_eh »

EMIRELADERO wrote: post #30
jonny_eh wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Cheating hurts innocent online gamers. Piracy hurts game developers/publishers. If you want a device you can hack, buy a PC (or a Steam Deck).

Is it really true that piracy hurts game developers? All I've seen is evidence for the contrary[1] As for your end statement, I believe having root access, or just the same level of control over the individual device as the manufacturer does after the sale, is a matter of consumer rights/protections ripe for legislation, not about "features". [1] https://arstechnica.com/gaming/2017/09/eu-study-finds-piracy...

> 45-percent error margin that makes the results less than statistically significant

Did you even read the link?

Re: Hacking the PS4 / PS5 Through the PS2 Emulator

#85

Post by Sunspark »

darren_ wrote: post #67
Sunspark wrote: post #53

I wonder if Sony is now going to rip out the PS2 emulator. They've removed features before. They tore OtherOS out of the PS3. I don't see PS2 compatibility as being sacred to the PS5.

The ars technica article about this has some additional info from the hacker about sony not really being able to do this: "CTurt stressed to Ars that it would be nearly impossible for Sony to plug the hole that enables mast1c0re. That's because a version of the exploitable PS2 emulator in question is packaged with each available PS2-on-PS4 game rather than stored separately as a core part of the console operating sys…

If Sony wanted to end PS2 support on the PS5, my theory is that an easy way for them to work around what is described in the quotes would be to simply issue a new system update which then refuses to run the name of the executable or loading a support library it needs to operate.

I believe it is doable, but the long-term impact to consumer loyalty is another question. Xbox is a peer system and people may move to it and potentially not return.

Re: Hacking the PS4 / PS5 Through the PS2 Emulator

#86

Post by EMIRELADERO »

thrdbndndn wrote: post #56
EMIRELADERO wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> 1) it is totally unfair for the honest buyers if other people can get it for free in an "illegal" way. I have never, ever seen anyone make that argument. How would that even work? "I paid fof this Smart TV. Then I heard about a massive shoplifting operation that took place on the store I bought it from. Damn! Why did I have to pay when those thiefs got many for free!". Doesn't hold up. > 2) The IP holders may simpl…

>I have never, ever seen anyone make that argument Well, now you see one, I am making it. Your analogy with tangible goods doesn't work. Shoplifting, or stealing, could be a felony and is heavily frown upon morally. The risk of getting caught up is much higher, and the consequence is more serious. I won't be angry about "thieves getting them for free" despite I paid for the TV, because I knew they will end up in jail…

> Your analogy with tangible goods doesn't work. Shoplifting, or stealing, could be a felony and is heavily frown upon morally. The risk of getting caught up is much higher, and the consequence is more serious.

> I won't be angry about "thieves getting them for free" despite I paid for the TV, because I knew they will end up in jails eventually, if not already.

So whether you get angry about it or not depends solely on the thieves getting punished, not on the act itself? Seems like a very narrow way to view it.

> And yes, I feel salty when I paid full price for X game while someone is getting it free.

Why? That has no effect on how you enjoy the game. Why would you get salty about that, considering it doesn't affect you in any way? Especially since you said yourself earlier that piracy doesn't "necessarily hurt dev in term of income", so you wouldn't even worry about the dev(s) not making any more games because of piracy.

What's the damage for you then?

Re: Hacking the PS4 / PS5 Through the PS2 Emulator

#87

Post by thrdbndndn »

EMIRELADERO wrote: post #86
thrdbndndn wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>I have never, ever seen anyone make that argument Well, now you see one, I am making it. Your analogy with tangible goods doesn't work. Shoplifting, or stealing, could be a felony and is heavily frown upon morally. The risk of getting caught up is much higher, and the consequence is more serious. I won't be angry about "thieves getting them for free" despite I paid for the TV, because I knew they will end up in jail…

> Your analogy with tangible goods doesn't work. Shoplifting, or stealing, could be a felony and is heavily frown upon morally. The risk of getting caught up is much higher, and the consequence is more serious. > I won't be angry about "thieves getting them for free" despite I paid for the TV, because I knew they will end up in jails eventually, if not already. So whether you get angry about it or not depends solely…

They same reason I hate about human right violation practice, despite it doesn't affect my in anyway (some even benefit me, like slavery labor).

(No, I'm not saying they are the "same thing" or the same level of seriousness. Just to demonstrate I can hate things that doesn't affect me negatively.)

Re: Hacking the PS4 / PS5 Through the PS2 Emulator

#88

Post by EMIRELADERO »

thrdbndndn wrote: post #87
EMIRELADERO wrote: post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Your analogy with tangible goods doesn't work. Shoplifting, or stealing, could be a felony and is heavily frown upon morally. The risk of getting caught up is much higher, and the consequence is more serious. > I won't be angry about "thieves getting them for free" despite I paid for the TV, because I knew they will end up in jails eventually, if not already. So whether you get angry about it or not depends solely…

They same reason I hate about human right violation practice, despite it doesn't affect my in anyway (some even benefit me, like slavery labor). (No, I'm not saying they are the "same thing" or the same level of seriousness. Just to demonstrate I can hate things that doesn't affect me negatively.)

That's kind of a circular argument, isn't it?

"Piracy is bad" -> Why? "(One reason is) People get angry that others are getting their paid stuff for free" -> Why would they get angry? -> "Because piracy is bad" -> Why?

etc.

Re: Hacking the PS4 / PS5 Through the PS2 Emulator

#89

Post by thrdbndndn »

EMIRELADERO wrote: post #88
thrdbndndn wrote: post #87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They same reason I hate about human right violation practice, despite it doesn't affect my in anyway (some even benefit me, like slavery labor). (No, I'm not saying they are the "same thing" or the same level of seriousness. Just to demonstrate I can hate things that doesn't affect me negatively.)

That's kind of a circular argument, isn't it? "Piracy is bad" -> Why? "(One reason is) People get angry that others are getting their paid stuff for free" -> Why would they get angry? -> "Because piracy is bad" -> Why? etc.

You are making up words for me.

Piracy is bad because it's unfair to honest buyers. This is literally my original argument. Not because people get angry about it, I never even mentioned that to begin with. You are the one who came up with "people get angry" angle by using a crappy analogy.

Do I really need to prove how this is unfair? A paid $60, got a copy of game. B paid $0 by illegal means, got a copy of game.

Same goes to shoplifting, actually. Not sure why it "doesn't hold up". I simply care less because police exists. Regardless if anyone "gets angry", it is an unfair situation.

Hell, you even made up another strawman: "Why would they get angry? -> "Because piracy is bad" -- said no one.

To be Mr. obvious, people get angry because they're in the disadvantaged end of an unfair situation.

Have a nice day, this is my last one.

Re: Hacking the PS4 / PS5 Through the PS2 Emulator

#90

Post by boltzmann-brain »

Cyph0n wrote: post #81
boltzmann-brain wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is heavily skewed. If you lived in Eastern Europe it was customary to drive down to Germany to buy PS1/2 because they were much cheaper there. I know several people who started their retail business just by bringing back car loads of PS2's. One guy even got a mocking nickname (something like "playstation") that stuck with him for decades after when he moved on to selling HiFi and AV out of his store. I absolutel…

Yep, it was the same in the Middle East. Immigrants and travelers to Europe and the US frequently brought back electronics, including game consoles. They were then modchipped locally.

I had no idea the silk road went this far. Would you have normally traveled through Russia / Georgia / Kazakhstan etc?
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