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US quietly urges more use of Russia fertilizer to ease food crisis

bloomberg.com

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Re: US quietly urges more use of Russia fertilizer to ease food crisis

#81

Post by riantogo »

tenpies wrote: post #42
nathanaldensr wrote: post #2

So "quiet" that Bloomberg's reporting on it? If you're a farmer, you're going to buy fertilizer from wherever and whomever unless prevented legally from doing so--and I, as a citizen of the US dependent on others growing this food on behalf of me, appreciate it.

You have to understand the utter diplomatic and geopolitical incompetence of the current US adminsitration. You're talking about the same administration that literally admitted in the open to be executing cyber attacks on Russia[1]. The fact that they haven't made most of North America glow in the dark is an utter miracle. And to make my point clear, the issue isn't that they're conducting cyber attacks - that's a gi…

What you think is the "quite part" is actually not. It is standard practice to announce the nature of the military attack, especially against a nuclear power. That is the reason why you see the exact weapons being sent to Ukraine. If you do these things unannounced, and later get caught, that is what gives Russia the carte blanche to retaliate.

Re: US quietly urges more use of Russia fertilizer to ease food crisis

#82

Post by tshaddox »

Jcowell wrote: post #72
varjag wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ah the classic "don't rattle Putin or nuclear war" defense.

Well yes? Is there any indication, given Putin’s back to a wall that he would not order nukes as a final fuck you ?

Then what are you suggesting? That Putin ought to be allowed to do literally anything he wants because if we tried to stop him he might nuke everyone?

Re: US quietly urges more use of Russia fertilizer to ease food crisis

#83

Post by jacobolus »

tenpies wrote: post #42
nathanaldensr wrote: post #2

So "quiet" that Bloomberg's reporting on it? If you're a farmer, you're going to buy fertilizer from wherever and whomever unless prevented legally from doing so--and I, as a citizen of the US dependent on others growing this food on behalf of me, appreciate it.

You have to understand the utter diplomatic and geopolitical incompetence of the current US adminsitration. You're talking about the same administration that literally admitted in the open to be executing cyber attacks on Russia[1]. The fact that they haven't made most of North America glow in the dark is an utter miracle. And to make my point clear, the issue isn't that they're conducting cyber attacks - that's a gi…

> gives them carte blanche to retaliate

No it doesn’t. Russia has been taking increasing amounts of direct action against other nuclear states for years (including sponsoring cyber attacks and e.g. criminally intervening in US elections). They aren’t going to start a nuclear war over e.g. the USA compromising their military computer networks and distributing the information discovered there.

Putin is doing everything he can to prevent escalation to a direct shooting war with NATO because he knows that in a conventional war NATO will wipe the floor with the Russian military, and a nuclear war is mutually assured destruction.

Re: US quietly urges more use of Russia fertilizer to ease food crisis

#84

Post by corrral »

tenpies wrote: post #42
nathanaldensr wrote: post #2

So "quiet" that Bloomberg's reporting on it? If you're a farmer, you're going to buy fertilizer from wherever and whomever unless prevented legally from doing so--and I, as a citizen of the US dependent on others growing this food on behalf of me, appreciate it.

You have to understand the utter diplomatic and geopolitical incompetence of the current US adminsitration. You're talking about the same administration that literally admitted in the open to be executing cyber attacks on Russia[1]. The fact that they haven't made most of North America glow in the dark is an utter miracle. And to make my point clear, the issue isn't that they're conducting cyber attacks - that's a gi…

I've actually been pleasantly surprised at how well Biden's administration has walked the tightrope on Ukraine. And though I'm very liberal by US standards, I'm not terribly partisan when it comes to foreign policy—I think Obama's foreign policy was largely disastrous, and have a lot more good things to say about Trump's than I thought I would when his term started (admittedly, more about intentions & gestures than actual effects, and there was still plenty that I didn't like)

Re: US quietly urges more use of Russia fertilizer to ease food crisis

#85

Post by stefan_ »

legitster wrote: post #26

1/5 of raw fertilizer materials come from Russia! Is there a reason Russia is so prolific a source of fertilizer? I assume it's a legacy of Soviet Union attitudes towards raw material production.

It's just a side-effect of basing the entire economy around fossil fuel exports. Fertilizer production then is like one elementary school step away from that.

Re: US quietly urges more use of Russia fertilizer to ease food crisis

#86

Post by nemo44x »

pkaye wrote: post #13

What happened to all the people pushing organic fertilizers? Why don't they source more of that?

The cost of living in "good times" where things are plentiful due to the status quo and existing policy is we have to listen to idiots who claim we're doing it all wrong and that we need to change our ways. These people's voices are squashed when times aren't so good because we have to actually succeed and get things done. But they'll be back once things are back to being good, complaining about everything, claiming the world is ending and that nothing is sustainable and that everything is broken.

Re: US quietly urges more use of Russia fertilizer to ease food crisis

#87

Post by JumpCrisscross »

cpursley wrote: post #69
JumpCrisscross wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> west must a) either know more about Russia and its plans than the public or b) are somewhat complicit in gaining from a long war. Or didn't know what was going on until well after the war was underway. U.S. tactical intelligence has no match on earth. American strategic intelligence is almost predictably garbage. From Iraq to Kabul to Kyiv, we've consistently called the shots wrong.

Many would argue that US tactical intelligence is overrated, as well. When's the last time the US fought against a near-peer?

> When's the last time the US fought against a near-peer?

When's the last time any major power fought a near peer?

I would have said we're getting solid evidence of American intelligence supremacy out of Ukraine. But given the incompetence of the Russian military it would be embarrassing to put them in the same league as China.

Re: US quietly urges more use of Russia fertilizer to ease food crisis

#88

Post by cpursley »

JumpCrisscross wrote: post #74
cpursley wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're getting downvoted by Americans with big fat paychecks in the Bay Area and other coastal cities on the energy self-sufficient North American content. Like it or not, Europe runs on Russian gas/oil/grain for the time being. The current crop of EU officials are probably not evil, but they are incredibly incompetent. By any object measure, the sanctions have filled the Russian Government's coffers and made Europe…

> any object measure, the sanctions have filled the Russian Government's coffers and made Europe much poorer With you until this point. Higher energy prices have in no way made up for the loss of Russia's reserves.

Russia has actually raised minimum wage and pensions by 10% due to the huge inflow of tax revenue. They also reduced the emergency 20% interest rate to 9.5% (about same as before). And I can't find the article, but I read somewhere that they're only losing about 1/3 of the original reserves that was originally announced.

The EU is getting played by both Russia and America.

Re: US quietly urges more use of Russia fertilizer to ease food crisis

#89

Post by colinmhayes »

me551ah wrote: post #47
yks wrote: post #29

The West could've ended this war by now if they just went all in on sending howitzers, MLRS and other heavy equipment into Ukraine but they keep slow dripping it, or just doing nothing like Germany. The most powerful societies in the world history just twiddle their thumbs while negative consequences keep mounting.

The west could have ended the war by holding talks between Biden and Putin too.

This just isn't true. Putin never signalled a willingness to hold good faith peace talks. Quite the contrary, he has continuously signalled how important he believes Ukraine is to his legacy. Nothing short of his death would have stopped this.

Re: US quietly urges more use of Russia fertilizer to ease food crisis

#90

Post by tshaddox »

nemo44x wrote: post #67
yks wrote: post #29

The West could've ended this war by now if they just went all in on sending howitzers, MLRS and other heavy equipment into Ukraine but they keep slow dripping it, or just doing nothing like Germany. The most powerful societies in the world history just twiddle their thumbs while negative consequences keep mounting.

You're literally asking for more death and destruction. Just think of what you're saying. Russia wins this war no matter what and the pointless cheerleading from the media and some politicians has been nothing but disposing of Ukrainian lives for the sole purpose of getting some type of bizarre revenge on Russia who they believe got Trump elected, or something. Sending more and more weapons only prolongs it and adds…

Are you suggesting that Putin ought to be allowed to invade any country he wants without resistance because resisting would only increase the death count? Or is there something specific about Ukraine?
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