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Why I Don't Like Golang (2016)

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Re: Why I Don't Like Golang (2016)

#81

Post by philliphaydon »

makeitdouble wrote: post #62
sriram_malhar wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Musicians and carpenters make far less than programmers, but they still buy their tools. Software people are too entitled. Even if you are not professional, you can still afford 54c a day ($200 a year). Even a programmer in India can.

This is an undue attack. We buy our computers and screens and keyboards, most of us are on commercial OS, we pay for SaaS at a non trivial price, and most of us also use additional personal apps that aren't free (including password managers, mail clients etc.). Those are actual tools for the trade. Arguing we should also buy every Jetbrains product is like arguing carpenters should buy line drawing AR goggles. Perhap…

“I’ll pay $1000’s to get all setup and running with everything I need, including a bunch of stuff I don’t need, but not the last $90 for some productive software to make more money”

Yeah ok.

Re: Why I Don't Like Golang (2016)

#82

Post by sam0x17 »

implying wrote: post #5

They've fixed the import / modules situation to a point where it's usable and much improved, and generics have been added. However, the issue this brings up about structs / types not explicitly declaring which interfaces they implement is a real and unaddressed problem, especially in large codebases. The only tool that I'm aware of that finds implementations is GoLand, at steep JetBrains prices. Figuring out what typ…

It's more than that though. There is just no standard library to be spoken of. I mean things like the most basic string processing methods, etc., are left to the programmer to sort out themself. Every time I've done contracting work on Go projects, I'm shocked by the things I have to implement from scratch (not that it isn't fun) that we take for granted in every other modern compiled languge I've tried (Rust, Crystal, Nim). I know this is more of an environment thing than a language thing, but in practice, language and environment are so intertwined it's pointless to not consider them together.

Re: Why I Don't Like Golang (2016)

#83

Post by sam0x17 »

bmitc wrote: post #25
voidfunc wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

When developers who usually make 6 figures of money complain about $90/yr IDE price I just cannot help laugh. Actually it's even better... the price elevators down from $90 -> year2 90 - 20% -> year3 90 - 40%. Over three years that's like $150-$200 total and it will save you so many headaches. But that's a steep price? Are you kidding? Why do developers hate tools that cost money when they save them time and allow th…

What's even worse is getting companies to pay for this stuff. Getting a company to buy software to help you do your job is like pulling teeth.

I dunno I've been in plenty of situations where a department head will literally beg me to buy things so they can reach the same budget spend as last year so their budget isn't slashed (DoD), and have seen the same situation in VC-backed startups looking to come up with tax write offs. Businesses for the most part love spending money and would rather do that than pay taxes, which is definitely a problem with corporate society these days.

Re: Why I Don't Like Golang (2016)

#84

Post by philliphaydon »

deltaonefour wrote: post #80
dehrmann wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm shocked at how often I see software engineers not paying for Sublime Text. These are people who get paid to write software not paying for software.

The use to pirate stuff all the time. Now it's actually more convenient for me to buy it. But the philosophy I always had was that as long as there were enough people like you paying for software, I wouldn't have to.

I think most people in the industry pirated software when they were students or just beginning. But now that we make money it’s easier to just buy it.

Friend of mine pirated photoshop when he was studying and after he finished and started his own business he started paying for it.

Re: Why I Don't Like Golang (2016)

#85

Post by xigoi »

philliphaydon wrote: post #81
makeitdouble wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is an undue attack. We buy our computers and screens and keyboards, most of us are on commercial OS, we pay for SaaS at a non trivial price, and most of us also use additional personal apps that aren't free (including password managers, mail clients etc.). Those are actual tools for the trade. Arguing we should also buy every Jetbrains product is like arguing carpenters should buy line drawing AR goggles. Perhap…

“I’ll pay $1000’s to get all setup and running with everything I need, including a bunch of stuff I don’t need, but not the last $90 for some productive software to make more money” Yeah ok.

You forgot the additional $1000 for a computer powerful enough to run JetBrains.

Re: Why I Don't Like Golang (2016)

#86

Post by sam0x17 »

sriram_malhar wrote: post #18
xigoi wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Professional developers in the USA usually make 6 figures.

Musicians and carpenters make far less than programmers, but they still buy their tools. Software people are too entitled. Even if you are not professional, you can still afford 54c a day ($200 a year). Even a programmer in India can.

We pay $3500 every 2 years to have up-to-date hardware

Re: Why I Don't Like Golang (2016)

#87

Post by gabereiser »

sam0x17 wrote: post #82
implying wrote: post #5

They've fixed the import / modules situation to a point where it's usable and much improved, and generics have been added. However, the issue this brings up about structs / types not explicitly declaring which interfaces they implement is a real and unaddressed problem, especially in large codebases. The only tool that I'm aware of that finds implementations is GoLand, at steep JetBrains prices. Figuring out what typ…

It's more than that though. There is just no standard library to be spoken of. I mean things like the most basic string processing methods, etc., are left to the programmer to sort out themself. Every time I've done contracting work on Go projects, I'm shocked by the things I have to implement from scratch (not that it isn't fun) that we take for granted in every other modern compiled languge I've tried (Rust, Crysta…

This isn’t true. Go has a basic standard package list. https://pkg.go.dev/std

Re: Why I Don't Like Golang (2016)

#88

Post by sam0x17 »

dehrmann wrote: post #47
voidfunc wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

When developers who usually make 6 figures of money complain about $90/yr IDE price I just cannot help laugh. Actually it's even better... the price elevators down from $90 -> year2 90 - 20% -> year3 90 - 40%. Over three years that's like $150-$200 total and it will save you so many headaches. But that's a steep price? Are you kidding? Why do developers hate tools that cost money when they save them time and allow th…

I'm shocked at how often I see software engineers not paying for Sublime Text. These are people who get paid to write software not paying for software.

I've looked at it before and I just don't get the appeal. UI doesn't feel sexy enough for me to spend 80% of my day in it.

Re: Why I Don't Like Golang (2016)

#89

Post by sam0x17 »

gabereiser wrote: post #87
sam0x17 wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's more than that though. There is just no standard library to be spoken of. I mean things like the most basic string processing methods, etc., are left to the programmer to sort out themself. Every time I've done contracting work on Go projects, I'm shocked by the things I have to implement from scratch (not that it isn't fun) that we take for granted in every other modern compiled languge I've tried (Rust, Crysta…

This isn’t true. Go has a basic standard package list. https://pkg.go.dev/std

Yes, and it's missing tons of things we take for granted in other langauges. If you look at the "strings" section it's so short. There aren't even convenience things like string reverse.

Re: Why I Don't Like Golang (2016)

#90

Post by morelisp »

quickthrower2 wrote: post #36
xigoi wrote: post #19

> if I name my source file i_love_linux.go, it won’t get compiled on my Mac What the fuck?

Searching around a few blogs mention _linux.go files are only compiled on Linux. But I see nothing in the official documentation, will at least in my quick searches. It will catch someone out who uses BSD as an acronym for something in their domain model (Bulk Sales Discount?) then xyz_bsd.go doesn't compile.

Idiomatically in Go that file would be named `xyz-bsd.go`. All special filename behavior is triggered by `_suffix`.
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