Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Legends Solar – Buy operating solar panels on commercial solar farms

legends.solar

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

81–90 of 167 posts

Re: Legends Solar – Buy operating solar panels on commercial solar farms

#81

Post by OmarIsmail »

I've been looking for something just like this! I find that people get really weird about solar stuff, so I'll explain why I've been looking for something like this.

1. I believe that man-made climate change is real and we should do something about it.

2. I want to limit/eliminate my own family's personal contribution to the warming of the planet for ethical and emotional reasons

3. I believe that solar is a "green" way to generate electricity, and at the limit if every house and building was covered in solar panels that would be a great world to live in

4. I want to help make that world a reality, and I'm not looking to maximize my ROI on the investment, it's not just about the money

5. I'd prefer much more solar energy production even if it's not the most efficient

6. I currently only have access to install solar panels on my own roof (which I'm already doing)

7. I think non-green energy production will only get more expensive, so solar energy is a decent diversified asset in a broader investment portfolio.

I've actually gone pretty deep in thinking about how I could do this, i.e. get a bunch of investors together and install solar panels on business roofs like schools, warehouses, etc.

I'm gonna request early access to this.

Re: Legends Solar – Buy operating solar panels on commercial solar farms

#83

Post by swestwood »

OmarIsmail wrote: post #81

I've been looking for something just like this! I find that people get really weird about solar stuff, so I'll explain why I've been looking for something like this. 1. I believe that man-made climate change is real and we should do something about it. 2. I want to limit/eliminate my own family's personal contribution to the warming of the planet for ethical and emotional reasons 3. I believe that solar is a "green"…

You should also check out Midday Tech: middaytech.com

There isn't the investment/ROI angle – instead it focuses on putting up new solar by providing $1000-$5000 incentives to families considering rooftop solar. It focuses on lower income families and places that get most of their electricity from coal for maximum impact + additionality.

Re: Legends Solar – Buy operating solar panels on commercial solar farms

#84

Post by yepnopemaybe »

GOONIMMUNE wrote: post #60
dsr_ wrote: post #51

In what ways is this better than investing in a hypothetical public utility that intends to make all its electricity from solar panels? In what ways is this worse than that?

> investing in a hypothetical public utility that intends to make all its electricity from solar panels? Is this something I can do as a retail investor? What sort of minimum investment is needed?

It would be pretty tough to get exposure to solar panel equity by any means - aside from providing a great experience, we actually will be pretty much the next closest thing to owning solar panels if you don't have a suburban home.

We are different from investing in a utility for two reasons. First, you'll own simple direct ownership in a panel, not in an entire organization and all its bureaucracies and stakeholders. I want it to be as close to a consumer product as possible, to feel personal, not like an investment. Second, you panel will slowly depreciate over time and eventually be liquidated where a utility is hypothetically perpetual.

Aside from that, utilities typically pay $.04 or so for power generated. We'll likely have a behind-the-meter arrangement with a commercial power purchaser (like a factory or hospital), which can boost the return but be somewhat more risky.

Re: Legends Solar – Buy operating solar panels on commercial solar farms

#86

Post by esses »

yepnopemaybe wrote: post #37
spinaltap wrote: post #8

At the end of the day, it all comes down to ROI. If this had a good ROI, it probably already attracted enough investors without needing to create such a investment product. If not, then I might as well buy SP500.

It might be useful to think of Legends Solar panels as a kind of fixed income security. It depreciates over time but produces a steady stream of dividends. Significantly lower risk than the stock market, but with somewhat predictable returns. The important thing we hope to capture is the experience... it'll feel much more like owning a consumer product than an investment.

Fixed assets depreciate over time, but fixed-income securities do not unless you are assuming inflation.

1. How are you defining risk in this context and comparing it to the stock market? There is no track record shown in the FAQs.

2. What is the "somewhat" in "somewhat predictable"? The 7.3% estimated returns seem to come out of thin air with no backing calculations to them.

3. How are you returning capital to investors? This is nowhere in the FAQ. Do I actually get what I put in back or am I buying an interest rate depending on the life of the panels hoping to break even at some point?

4. If there is no secondary market, how do I re-coup any of my initial investment? Am I locked in for life? Circles back to question 3, is the principal returned after a fixed amount of time?

5. Do I receive a K-1 and operating losses due to panel depreciation?

Re: Legends Solar – Buy operating solar panels on commercial solar farms

#87

Post by yepnopemaybe »

RyEgswuCsn wrote: post #46

Is this... technically "securitization of the weather"?

lol, interesting way to think about it.

I think about it as the opposite of securitization. We are designing a produce to have as few layers of abstraction, complexity, and bureaucracy as possible so that it feels like owning a real product, not like an investment.

Re: Legends Solar – Buy operating solar panels on commercial solar farms

#88

Post by dsr_ »

GOONIMMUNE wrote: post #60
dsr_ wrote: post #51

In what ways is this better than investing in a hypothetical public utility that intends to make all its electricity from solar panels? In what ways is this worse than that?

> investing in a hypothetical public utility that intends to make all its electricity from solar panels? Is this something I can do as a retail investor? What sort of minimum investment is needed?

Nearly all public utilities are traded on the open markets. In the normal course of things, the minimum investment is either one dollar (if your broker supports fractional share trades) or one share (generally less than $200: there are few companies that like to follow Berkshire Hathaway's practice).

None of them, to the best of my knowledge, are currently planning on being 100% solar. It's unlikely, although a 100% renewable company is pretty likely to either now exist or happen shortly. Hydro-Quebec is, courtesy Wikipedia:

hydroelectricity (96.78%)

wind (2.16%)

biomass, biogas and waste (0.75%)

nuclear (0.19%)

thermal (0.12%)

Re: Legends Solar – Buy operating solar panels on commercial solar farms

#89

Post by yepnopemaybe »

mym1990 wrote: post #85

Viability and business model aside, can I just say I love the style and layout of the site? Its simple, but also a little bit quirky(in a good way) and approachable. Best of luck with this endeavor!

Aw, thanks! My background is in product design and I made it myself using WebFlow. Sadly, its one of the first things I've had to give up as other concerns within Legends have dominated my time. I still art direct it though, and design is gonna be essential to all our products.

Re: Legends Solar – Buy operating solar panels on commercial solar farms

#90

Post by esses »

yepnopemaybe wrote: post #80
foobiekr wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So let me get this straight. You are soliciting engagement and don’t even have the financials worked out?

I'd say we are 80% of the way there - every solar facility will have different traits and economics as an investment. We have the legal infrastructure and finance partners to make it happen pretty quick. As with any investment, we can't make claims about financials until everything is finalized and vetted. That will have to wait until we have a pro forma ready to go. Soliciting 'indications of interest' is a fairly c…

You are soliciting "indications of interest" with an estimated 7.3% yield with no justification whatsoever on the site to back it up.
Post reply on HN