Windows 11 may not be as popular as Microsoft had hoped • Hacker News Board

Re: Windows 11 may not be as popular as Microsoft had hoped

#81

Post by kyriakos » Mon, Apr 04, 2022, 2:43 AM UTC

w4rh4wk5 wrote: post #14

I'd really like to know how much Microsoft's behavior with recent Windows versions pays off. Specifically bundling lots of unwanted apps, forcing Edge and Defender down people's throats, removing basic UI customization features, etc. The fact that they are still doing this today suggests that they get something out of these decisions. Or at least they think so. I can only imagine that the part of customers being alie…

I think we keep hearing complaints but they come from a vocal minority. I use both Windows 10 and 11 daily and the issues people are describing are exaggerated most of the time. Not saying they don't exist but personally other than the task bar regressions everything else is actually a lot more polished in 11 than 10.

Windows defender is pretty good and edge is a decent browser but the same way Windows annoys you to use it Google uses its services to force chrome on you (for example I get a popup on Gmail every time I open it asking me to switch to chrome no matter how many times I dismiss it, I assume Firefox gets the same).

So maybe as users we got used to the idea of the big corporations trying to fight for our attention.

Re: Windows 11 may not be as popular as Microsoft had hoped

#82

Post by kyriakos » Mon, Apr 04, 2022, 2:45 AM UTC

rsynnott wrote: post #66

supernovae wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

macos also dropped support for 2015 hardware in Big Sur..

Eh? No it didn't. Compatibility list: https://support.apple.com/kb/sp833 It works on anything with a Haswell or later and Intel or AMD graphics, essentially. (Note that the MacBook is 2015 because there was no product called that between about 2009 and 2015; the iMac Pro is 2017 because that's when it was introduced).

Windows 11 works too, the workaround is official and at the same time windows 10 still receives updates so it's not like Microsoft killed older hardware by setting new requirements for Windows 11.

Re: Windows 11 may not be as popular as Microsoft had hoped

#83

Post by kyriakos » Mon, Apr 04, 2022, 2:49 AM UTC

hotpotamus wrote: post #61

loloquwowndueo wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In my experience people balk when they realize they’re not using Windows or Office. I’ve literally had someone sit in front of a Linux computer with OpenOffice and work fine on it until they realized “hey the title bar says OpenOffice Calc - it’s not excel! I don’t know how to use this!” Despite the fact they were using it just fine. At this point no amount of convincing made them give it another try - they’d just cr…

I was wondering how much native MS Office matters these days. I've been using OWA and Office 365 via browser for the better part of a decade on a Linux workstation because that's the compromise it took, but the experience was never good. I wonder if native would make much difference.

For basic usage the browser variants are good enough but Excel application is significantly more powerful. If you are an excel power user there is no non native alternative at the moment.

Re: Windows 11 may not be as popular as Microsoft had hoped

#84

Post by kyriakos » Mon, Apr 04, 2022, 2:50 AM UTC

technion wrote: post #73

hotpotamus wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I doubt Brenda would care much if she was running something like RHEL for work since it can run a browser as good as anything. I assume the main thing keeping Windows around in her case is all the IT endpoint management stuff built around the MS ecosystem. Personally, I'd probably be all in on Ubuntu or some derivative if not for gaming.

Really the experience supporting users across lots of organisations is at odds to that. Coming from a place where changing the Windows background from the default XP theme resulted in people stating they literally weren't able to work and actually refusing to work for several days , having to hack up the Chrome deployment so the shortcut uses the IE icon and calls it "Internet Explorer", Brenda in accounting absolute…

Depends what Brenda is using at home these days too

Re: Windows 11 may not be as popular as Microsoft had hoped

#85

Post by kyriakos » Mon, Apr 04, 2022, 2:52 AM UTC

stagger87 wrote: post #80

jeffdubin wrote: post #18

A huge number of consumers who can't upgrade to Windows 11 due to unsupported hardware will instead opt for an iPad or Chromebook. Everything is either web- or app-based, and people don't want the complexity of Windows. Microsoft will lose a big chunk of the Windows user base this way.

Why wouldn't they just stay on win10? It's not like it's going anywhere?

And this is exactly why people complaining about not being able to upgrade is not the mainstream opinion. The issue with backwards compatibility is coming up from people feeling left out.

Re: Windows 11 may not be as popular as Microsoft had hoped

#86

Post by kyriakos » Mon, Apr 04, 2022, 2:53 AM UTC

vyrotek wrote: post #12

The worst mistake was removing the ability to ungroup taskbar items! Opening more than one instance of an application is a terrible experience right now. The icons are often unresponsive, the indicator that something is open is literally just a tiny dot. Instead of addressing this I feel like Microsoft is just going to continue to add tabs to all their applications as justification for it. Edge, VS Code, Windows Term…

Definitely the taskbar and start menu was rushed out before it was feature complete. Unfortunately looks like it takes them way too long to fix it too.

Re: Windows 11 may not be as popular as Microsoft had hoped

#87

Post by vba616 » Mon, Apr 04, 2022, 2:58 AM UTC

Syonyk wrote: post #52

Sorry, what did they think was going to happen when people saw just how blatantly Microsoft said, "You know, the problem with Windows 10 is that we just haven't expressed enough disdain for our eyeballs? The ones we can't really sell to our real customers yet because we wrote Windows 10 as an OS..." I will not run Windows 11 on any personal computer. I will discourage anyone else from doing so. Reasons, in no particu…

Is it practical to run either 10 or 11 in a VM for doing ordinary chores on the Internet?

Re: Windows 11 may not be as popular as Microsoft had hoped

#88

Post by vba616 » Mon, Apr 04, 2022, 3:03 AM UTC

annoyingnoob wrote: post #27

I'm running Windows 11. Its just like Windows 10 but with many annoying UI changes.

I've been waiting for MS to start pressuring me. When I look at the Windows Update control panel, they aren't even trying to encourage the upgrade to 11, even though they say my computer meets the requirements.

i.e. "Some Windows 10 features aren't available in Windows 11. Certain apps and features may have additional requirements"

Wow, that sounds great. Literally the only thing they have to say is that it's a downgrade. I think that deserves a pause to consider how weird that is. I might even be a bit put out if I was an employee who worked on 11.

Re: Windows 11 may not be as popular as Microsoft had hoped

#89

Post by amanzi » Mon, Apr 04, 2022, 3:56 AM UTC

Windows 11 was the straw that broke the camel's back for me, and I no longer have any Windows PCs at home. I also had a friend ask me recently if he should upgrade his Windows 10 PC to Windows 11 and I told him to stay on Windows 10 as long as possible.

Microsoft only have themselves to blame for a whole raft of boneheaded decisions. Starting from when they changed course from: "Windows 10 will be the last version of Windows ever...", to then releasing a buggy and incomplete Windows 11. And since then a constant stream of hostile decisions relating to default browsers, more invasive adverts, and the unescapable MSN gossip articles that seem to pop up all over the place (e.g. you can't get rid of the MSN "news" articles from the widget sidebar thing they added to Windows 11).

Re: Windows 11 may not be as popular as Microsoft had hoped

#90

Post by 0des » Mon, Apr 04, 2022, 4:11 AM UTC

kyriakos wrote: post #83

hotpotamus wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I was wondering how much native MS Office matters these days. I've been using OWA and Office 365 via browser for the better part of a decade on a Linux workstation because that's the compromise it took, but the experience was never good. I wonder if native would make much difference.

For basic usage the browser variants are good enough but Excel application is significantly more powerful. If you are an excel power user there is no non native alternative at the moment.

Kyriakos Grizzly?