Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Google Fi bricked my iPhone 11 Pro Max (2020)

medium.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

81–90 of 100 posts

Re: Google Fi bricked my iPhone 11 Pro Max (2020)

#81

Post by Nextgrid »

gusmd wrote: post #54

> I learned that Google Fi exclusively uses the T-Mobile network for iPhone customers, and activating a Google Fi SIM with an iPhone causes T-Mobile to lock the phone to the T-Mobile network (which is illegal, since the user hasn’t entered into any service agreement with T-Mobile). This happened to me with an unlocked iPhone, bought at Best Buy, that I activated with a T-Mobile SIM card as well. Tried Apple support f…

At the very least Apple should’ve had big visible warnings displayed right on the boot screen for locked devices so that scummy carriers can’t “accidentally” sell locked phones as unlocked to unsuspecting customers.

But then again it took them ages to even introduce a settings menu to be able to tell which carrier a given phone was locked to; previously there was no way to know without bruteforcing with all the SIMs and Apple Support explicitly refused to tell you.

Apple may look like the good guys on the outside but they’re absolutely in bed with the carriers.

Re: Google Fi bricked my iPhone 11 Pro Max (2020)

#82

Post by Nextgrid »

elmerfud wrote: post #69
rahimnathwani wrote: post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Neither Google nor T-Mobile locked the phone. _Apple_ programmed it to lock _itself_ to the first carrier with which it was used.

This is 100% the correct answer! The user can also log into his Apple account and unlock the phone. The reason T-Mobile customer service won't do it is because without a service plan they can't verify ownership.

Are you confusing the Find My iPhone feature or Activation Lock?

None of these depend on the SIM besides a SIM change triggering a re-check of the activation lock status (it’ll just ask you for your Apple ID credentials).

Carrier lock is not something the user has easy visibility on (until recently it wasn’t even possible to tell which carrier a phone was locked to without trying them all) and definitely no control over.

Re: Google Fi bricked my iPhone 11 Pro Max (2020)

#83

Post by Nextgrid »

tedivm wrote: post #12
R0b0t1 wrote: post #4

Did he try to do anything in a small claims court? Get a consultation with a lawyer? This is such a slam dunk it seems infinitely worth pursuing. Obviously yes you'd rather not, but I never see updates on if the issue gets solved.

If you sue google they'll close your entire google account, which in turn can cause a lot of issues for a lot of people. I personally refuse to use gmail in part because of this- if you have a problem with one google service you risk losing access to all of them.

There’s more to the story though - Google is actually collateral damage in this case and had nothing to do with locking the phone.

Best Buy scammed them by selling them a phone that automatically locks itself to the first carrier it sees, which is T-Mobile since Fi runs on that.

A small claims court case against Best Buy or even a warranty claim should sort it.

Re: Google Fi bricked my iPhone 11 Pro Max (2020)

#84

Post by Nextgrid »

more_corn wrote: post #33

That’s pretty messed up. Sometimes local phone shops can unlock your phone for you.

Pretty much impossible with Apple unless they know someone crooked within Apple or the locking carrier.

It’s not like modem locks where calculating an NCK code is sufficient - here the phone will regularly check in with Apple and the response tells it whether the SIM is allowed. It’s enforced at the OS level, and ironically, the modem itself is never locked.

Re: Google Fi bricked my iPhone 11 Pro Max (2020)

#85

Post by R0b0t1 »

Someone1234 wrote: post #25
R0b0t1 wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I just went to Best Buy's website. There's unlocked phones. It's typically the carrier branch stores that don't sell unlocked devices, though they often do in my experience (you'll get the phone cheaper somewhere else). If you read carefully, the carrier selection on the website is really just for carrier compatibility; you are offered the option of paying the entire price upfront. The shocker to me here is you can p…

Those are used phones you're looking at. If you checked the reviews you will see that "not really unlocked" is a common complaint on top. If you go look at their new inventory even if you "activate today" you still need to select a carrier.

Nope, brand new. You can pay entire sticker price up front and get them unlocked.

Re: Google Fi bricked my iPhone 11 Pro Max (2020)

#86

Post by R0b0t1 »

sangnoir wrote: post #74
indymike wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> By you going directly to civil courts you are breaching their TOS which is a reason for termination That's a novel theory. So if I sue the power company because a cherry picker rear-ended my 1978 land yacht they can just shut me off in -20 winter weather because I sued them?

> That's a novel theory. This is not novel at all - patent cross-licensing has been using similar language for decades: "Your license to our bag of patents is valid unless you take us to court - then all bets are off". It's a very short jump from patent licensing to Terms of Service, I bet there's a lot of related case law.

Quite different as disputes between businesses are seen quite differently from consumer and business disputes.

The protections in the US are not nearly as strong as, say, Germany, where it's entirely possible that a grocery store can't ban you because they're the only place to shop. The right to do business with who you wish is more protected in the US. At the same time, there are laws about and the courts look poorly on retaliating on a weaker party for seeking legitimate redress.

Re: Google Fi bricked my iPhone 11 Pro Max (2020)

#87

Post by giomasce »

kbuck wrote: post #63
dataflow wrote: post #5

> I learned that Google Fi exclusively uses the T-Mobile network for iPhone customers, and activating a Google Fi SIM with an iPhone causes T-Mobile to lock the phone to the T-Mobile network (which is illegal, since the user hasn’t entered into any service agreement with T-Mobile). Wow, carriers can just remotely lock an unlocked phone? How does this even work? Is this some kind of command that the SIM card sends the…

The phone wasn't remotely locked; Best Buy's entire new iPhone stock uses "flex activation" which will automatically lock the phone to the first SIM card that's inserted. Fi's primary network is T-Mobile, so for a Fi SIM, this means T-Mobile. The blame here lies on Best Buy (for not making it clear that this occurs) and Apple (for designing and supporting "flex activation" -- which will still carrier-lock the phone e…

But what is the point of this flex activation scheme?

Re: Google Fi bricked my iPhone 11 Pro Max (2020)

#88

Post by kbuck »

giomasce wrote: post #87
kbuck wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The phone wasn't remotely locked; Best Buy's entire new iPhone stock uses "flex activation" which will automatically lock the phone to the first SIM card that's inserted. Fi's primary network is T-Mobile, so for a Fi SIM, this means T-Mobile. The blame here lies on Best Buy (for not making it clear that this occurs) and Apple (for designing and supporting "flex activation" -- which will still carrier-lock the phone e…

But what is the point of this flex activation scheme?

Easier inventory management for stores like Best Buy. Instead of having to carry SKUs for the T-Mobile, AT&T, Verizon, etc. carrier-locked variant of each phone (which, I'll admit results in some combinatorial explosion), they can carry 1 SKU for each truly different hardware configuration. Then it magically "becomes" an AT&T locked phone when they insert the SIM in the store.

If you buy it subsidized or through a carrier payment plan, this works as intended (and they'll refuse to let you have the phone before the SIM is inserted). If you meant to buy an unlocked phone, you've been given an annoying lesson to buy directly from the manufacturer.

Re: Google Fi bricked my iPhone 11 Pro Max (2020)

#89

Post by voso »

null0pointer wrote: post #21

> it looks like you’ve been predominantly using Fi abroad over the past 3 months I used my Fi SIM and international roaming continuously outside the US for 13 months over 2020/21 and never received a message like this or had my service cut. Makes me wonder if I just slipped through the cracks in their detection or something.

I just got an email last month booting me off after 22 months continuously abroad with no problems. This coincided with a lot of other people complaining online that they also just got cut. They definitely don't have any "detection" for you to slip through, they just check and enforce this manually occasionally.

Re: Google Fi bricked my iPhone 11 Pro Max (2020)

#90

Post by selfhoster69 »

tedivm wrote: post #7

Google Fi (originally Project Fi) was amazing when it first came out, but at some point they switched to contracted support with no ability to resolve issues (it's not even the support people's fault, as they literally don't have the power to do anything). For awhile Google people used to hang out in the Google Fi subreddit but they seem to have mostly moved on to other projects or companies. Besides locking phones l…

Kind of regretting storing all my photos on Google Photos. Downloading takeout data always has missing photos :(
Post reply on HN