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Vaccines and Omicron mean Covid now less deadly than flu in England

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Re: Vaccines and Omicron mean Covid now less deadly than flu in England

#81

Post by moistly »

tptacek wrote: post #52
quantum_magpie wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>So were you going through life wearing a mask to mitigate the risk of a deadly flu in 2018 and before? I think probably not, but if your priority is risk mitigation, shouldn't you have been? During flu season? Of course. As well as soon any cold symptoms were felt. My institution would also issue stay-at-home recommendations during flu outbreaks.

You might have worn a mask during previous flu seasons, but it'd be helpful to acknowledge that almost nobody else did. Prior to COVID, masks were a curiosity, not a norm.

> Prior to COVID, masks were a curiosity, not a norm.

Only because we live in a “me” society and not a “we” society. If we were sensible, masking up would be normal when one has a cold/there’s a local flu outbreak. So much illness and lost productivity would be easily avoided with a minor change in expectations and behaviour.

Re: Vaccines and Omicron mean Covid now less deadly than flu in England

#82

Post by moistly »

Reason077 wrote: post #28
somewhereoutth wrote: post #4

It may well be less deadly, but it is far more contagious. Reinfection also seems to be not uncommon. We do not fully understand the long term effects of even a mild case, or indeed how repeated reinfection might compound any such effects, given that we might expect to catch it once or twice a year as opposed to once or twice in our lives for flu.

> "once or twice in our lives for flu." I guess some people are more susceptible than others (or have more risk due to lifestyle factors), but only once or twice in a lifetime ? I'd guess I've had a really bad flu at least once every 4-5 years or so on average in my lifetime, and moderate cases probably every 1-2 years. I had Covid twice as well, within a year (both times in 2020, before vaccines were available).

Were those actually tested to prove they are a flu virus? Because typically, people say they have the flu when in actual they have a really bad cold.

Re: Vaccines and Omicron mean Covid now less deadly than flu in England

#83

Post by Volundr »

tptacek wrote: post #52
quantum_magpie wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>So were you going through life wearing a mask to mitigate the risk of a deadly flu in 2018 and before? I think probably not, but if your priority is risk mitigation, shouldn't you have been? During flu season? Of course. As well as soon any cold symptoms were felt. My institution would also issue stay-at-home recommendations during flu outbreaks.

You might have worn a mask during previous flu seasons, but it'd be helpful to acknowledge that almost nobody else did. Prior to COVID, masks were a curiosity, not a norm.

> Prior to COVID, masks were a curiosity, not a norm.

In the US and much of Europe. In other countries they absolutely were the norm. I'm not advocating for permanent mask wearing, but I absolutely DO think we should have shown more concern for others prior to Covid. It drove me nuts how many people would show up to work with "just a mild flu" or "just a cold" with no concern for the likelihood they might pass it on to others.

Re: Vaccines and Omicron mean Covid now less deadly than flu in England

#84

Post by stjohnswarts »

DaiPlusPlus wrote: post #5
OnlyMortal wrote: post #3

As it happens, there’s been a 52% increase in infections and 17% increase in hospitalisation recently. Death rates are flat though. Was reported on Channel 5 News today.

What about the long-term impact on the lungs, etc? > Was reported on Channel 5 News today. That does not fill me with confidence.

Evidently it can do brain damage as well as recently noted in some studies.

Re: Vaccines and Omicron mean Covid now less deadly than flu in England

#85

Post by terminatornet »

RobertMiller wrote: post #23
awb wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Preparing for the worst and mitigating risk != being terrified

So were you going through life wearing a mask to mitigate the risk of a deadly flu in 2018 and before? I think probably not, but if your priority is risk mitigation, shouldn't you have been? Risk mitigation is not my priority. If it were, I'd never ride my bike again, even with my helmet. I'd never go kayaking, or rock climbing. I wouldn't swim in lakes, and you'd never catch me in the ocean. If I were preparing for…

Did you learn to swim before trying swimming in lakes or did you just jump in one day? seems like a risk mitigation to me if you took any lessons or practiced at all.

No one's asking for everyone to hide in their houses forever, we want increased testing, contact tracing, and mechanisms for community protection that kick in when cases start to rise, not after they've reached critical mass. Think of these like the swimming lessons you took and laps you did in the pool before you moved on to the lake.

Re: Vaccines and Omicron mean Covid now less deadly than flu in England

#86

Post by chrismcb »

RobertMiller wrote: post #23
awb wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Preparing for the worst and mitigating risk != being terrified

So were you going through life wearing a mask to mitigate the risk of a deadly flu in 2018 and before? I think probably not, but if your priority is risk mitigation, shouldn't you have been? Risk mitigation is not my priority. If it were, I'd never ride my bike again, even with my helmet. I'd never go kayaking, or rock climbing. I wouldn't swim in lakes, and you'd never catch me in the ocean. If I were preparing for…

While risk mitigation isn't your priority, you do it, all the time. The reward for riding your bike far outweighs what little risk exists. So you ride your bike. Not doing something had a risk as well. Not riding your bike may mean walking on the street for longer or not getting enough exercise. The cost of wearing a mask far outweighs the risk of catching the flu.

Re: Vaccines and Omicron mean Covid now less deadly than flu in England

#87

Post by RobertMiller »

terminatornet wrote: post #85
RobertMiller wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So were you going through life wearing a mask to mitigate the risk of a deadly flu in 2018 and before? I think probably not, but if your priority is risk mitigation, shouldn't you have been? Risk mitigation is not my priority. If it were, I'd never ride my bike again, even with my helmet. I'd never go kayaking, or rock climbing. I wouldn't swim in lakes, and you'd never catch me in the ocean. If I were preparing for…

Did you learn to swim before trying swimming in lakes or did you just jump in one day? seems like a risk mitigation to me if you took any lessons or practiced at all. No one's asking for everyone to hide in their houses forever, we want increased testing, contact tracing, and mechanisms for community protection that kick in when cases start to rise, not after they've reached critical mass. Think of these like the swi…

Lakes are risky even if you know how to swim. There are amoeba that can swim up your nose and into your brain, giving you a very painful death. This risk can be trivially mitigated by wearing a noseplug or by refraining from swimming in lakes at all. I don't do either of these things, because I don't give a shit about the risk of some amoeba. Some people do, but most people don't.

Are there some risks I choose to mitigate? Of course. But there are maaany more risks that I choose to ignore. Everybody is entitled to their own opinions on which risks they want to tolerate and which are intolerable. Which leads to my next point..

>No one's asking for everyone to hide in their houses forever, we want [...]

Everybody has their own set of 'common sense' desires, but virtually none of those desires is universal. Using the 'royal we' to implicitly upgrade your personal desires to the desires of society in general is a tedious rhetorical trick. As for general population trends, covid mitigations were quite popular for the past two years, but with every day that passes more and more people stop caring. Go outside and see it for yourself, mask usage is dropping off a cliff even in the progressive west coast city I call home. There will come a day, soon, when wearing a mask will make you the odd one out.

Re: Vaccines and Omicron mean Covid now less deadly than flu in England

#88

Post by RobertMiller »

chrismcb wrote: post #86
RobertMiller wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So were you going through life wearing a mask to mitigate the risk of a deadly flu in 2018 and before? I think probably not, but if your priority is risk mitigation, shouldn't you have been? Risk mitigation is not my priority. If it were, I'd never ride my bike again, even with my helmet. I'd never go kayaking, or rock climbing. I wouldn't swim in lakes, and you'd never catch me in the ocean. If I were preparing for…

While risk mitigation isn't your priority, you do it, all the time. The reward for riding your bike far outweighs what little risk exists. So you ride your bike. Not doing something had a risk as well. Not riding your bike may mean walking on the street for longer or not getting enough exercise. The cost of wearing a mask far outweighs the risk of catching the flu.

No post body was provided.

Re: Vaccines and Omicron mean Covid now less deadly than flu in England

#89

Post by kazinator »

somewhereoutth wrote: post #60
kazinator wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Long Covid" is mainly just hypochondria. A lot less of it is real than the hype would have you believe. The media loves spooky stuff because it generates clicks. Hypochondriacs are a thing: they are out there. Some of them have gotten Covid-19, and that of course turns into their new obsession.

I'm afraid it is all too real. Reality keeps happening regardless of whether it is click inducing or not! We should try to get handle on how serious the problem is, and what may be done about it. More science is coming in now.

Some observed effects may be real, but the alleged association isn't real until proven.

Simply, too many people have had Covid to be able to squarely blame prior Covid infection for everything weird that's happening to everyone health-wise.

Maybe those people would have developed those symptoms anyway. A pandemic broke out and so, like millions of others, they got it, and now their inevitable predicament (those weird symptoms) get blamed on that, which may be wrong.

All sorts of people had all sorts of weird health issues; and now all sorts of people with weird health issues also have a Covid-19 history, because it's common to have one.

If Covid were a rare disease, it would be different. Say that only 100 people in the United States got Covid-19 in a particular year, and then 79 of them had weird symptoms months and months later. That would strongly indicate there is something there.

Look, we all have to die. From now on, whenever someone dies (spontaneously, not accidentally), do we blame it on Covid-19, if they ever had it?

A: Did you hear? Bob died last week. Heart attack. Just turned 69.

B: Yikes, I just remembered something: didn't he have Covid-19 back in 2021 when he was, what, ... 43?

A and B, in unison: OMG, long Covid!

B: Caught up with him.

A: Got him in the end, wow.

Re: Vaccines and Omicron mean Covid now less deadly than flu in England

#90

Post by kazinator »

terminatornet wrote: post #33
kazinator wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Long Covid" is mainly just hypochondria. A lot less of it is real than the hype would have you believe. The media loves spooky stuff because it generates clicks. Hypochondriacs are a thing: they are out there. Some of them have gotten Covid-19, and that of course turns into their new obsession.

interesting, i hadn't heard that. could you tell my what research university in your ass you pulled that out from?

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