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Trudeau Invokes Emergencies Act

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Re: Trudeau Invokes Emergencies Act

#81

Post by zozbot234 »

e4e78a06 wrote: post #47
itslennysfault wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeeeeeah, I don't know about that. Anyone with their truck there risks forfeiting the asset that was used in commission of a crime. AKA their livelihood and likely most expensive asset. There is certainly not a bottomless pit of people wishing to do that.

Confiscating peoples' assets does not exactly engender you to a lot of political support. You're risking a massive loss in the next elections if you do that, just like how Democrats in the US are also facing huge electoral pressures on crime and COVID restrictions [1]. [1]: https://www.nytimes.com/2022/02/08/us/politics/new-york-mask...

> You're risking a massive loss in the next elections if you do that

You think most Canadians support the illegal blockade? Really? Evidence please.

Re: Trudeau Invokes Emergencies Act

#82

Post by buscoquadnary »

tedivm wrote: post #70
e4e78a06 wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Confiscating peoples' assets does not exactly engender you to a lot of political support. You're risking a massive loss in the next elections if you do that, just like how Democrats in the US are also facing huge electoral pressures on crime and COVID restrictions [1]. [1]: https://www.nytimes.com/2022/02/08/us/politics/new-york-mask...

This idea that there's a crime wave seems to be pushed here and on reddit by month old accounts with no real proof. The reality is that crime is down in most places. Lets look at San Francisco. I'm going to get my stats right from the San Francisco Police Department. Homocide - Down 20% Rape - Down 23.8% Robbery - Down 20.7% Assault - Down 8.8% Human Trafficking - Down 83.3% Burglary - Down 45.4% Motor Vehicle Theft…

It's funny you say that because many people I know said they've simply stopped recording or responding to crime because everyone knows there will be no consequences for arresting somebody and the risk isn't worth arresting people in most cases.

The prediction was that next people would use the evidence that there are fewer crimes being reported as proof that nothing is wrong. This does seem very much like what we are seeing here.

Re: Trudeau Invokes Emergencies Act

#83

Post by sojournerc »

tyleo wrote: post #39

I’m not in Ottowa and I feel like I’m not sure what to believe here. On one hand, if the protests really were peaceful, I do not believe the government should shut them down. On the other hand, I’ve heard the protests have caused millions in trade to be shut down which I would not consider a peaceful act. If some non-citizen entity shut down millions in trade, I don’t think it would be viewed as peaceful. Should the…

> On the other hand, I’ve heard the protests have caused millions in trade to be shut down which I would not consider a peaceful act.

Since when did economic disruption become violence? I just don't understand. It makes zero sense to redefine violence to mean "something that inconveniences me, that I disagree with", Where does that end?

When next the liberals want to protest something - an oil pipeline for instance (economic disruption) - would that also be called violence?

Re: Trudeau Invokes Emergencies Act

#84

Post by dang »

908B64B197 wrote: post #66
MattGaiser wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Two-thirds of Canadians support military force to end Ottawa protests: poll https://toronto.citynews.ca/2022/02/12/two-thirds-of-canadia... The current approach seems to be a lot more mild than what the public would accept.

Quoted post unavailable.

Please don't take HN threads further into flamewar hell. This internet track leads nowhere interesting.

https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

Re: Trudeau Invokes Emergencies Act

#85

Post by synthos »

Jackim wrote: post #28
ameminator wrote: post #12

Shameful that a peaceful protest is met with this response. How can a person protest meaningfully if any peaceful protest can be called illegal? I do understand that the truckers were disturbing the peace of ordinary people - I think this should be discouraged. However there must be a way to peacefully assemble without the government's approval. I don't see how we can have meaningful civil discourse if you need permi…

I live in Ottawa and I assure you that this protest is not peaceful. I've had friends physically assaulted, spit on, and yelled at just for wearing a mask into a business. Not to mention the constant honking that was reaching levels above 100db inside people's homes. Homeless shelters were raided by protestors, businesses have been forced to close due to threats, and people are afraid to leave their homes.

Coffee shop with the window smashed (speculated it was because of the visible pride flag)

These trucks are extremely difficult to remove. And while you can still remove them if the air brakes are on it takes longer. Not only that, most rig towing companies won't do anything for fear of reprisal.

Re: Trudeau Invokes Emergencies Act

#86

Post by [deleted] »

MattGaiser wrote: post #67
nirav72 wrote: post #33

This is definately going to back fire on him and his administration. There weren't any major incidence of violence or rioting. They got the bridge cleared. He should've left it at that and let it fizzle out.

> Two-thirds of Canadians support military force to end Ottawa protests: poll https://toronto.citynews.ca/2022/02/12/two-thirds-of-canadia... The current approach seems to be a lot more mild than what the public would accept.

[deleted]

Re: Trudeau Invokes Emergencies Act

#87

Post by cf100clunk »

908B64B197 wrote: post #49
650 wrote: post #18

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2020_Canadian_pipeline_and_rai... "Prime Minister Justin Trudeau said politicians should not be telling the police how to deal with protesters and that resolution should come through dialogue" Millions of dollars in damage by these protestors (railway above). Protests for me, but not for thee. Vaguely remember stuff like: "Your right to freedom of speech stops where it harms others" (hat…

Could you imagine this in America? "Don't like first amendment speech? Just suspend the constitution!" We should start processing asylum claims from the north...

On the video of the announcement you can clearly see & hear them state that all actions will be subject to the Charter Of Rights And Freedoms. Go look/listen.

Re: Trudeau Invokes Emergencies Act

#88

Post by Jackim »

busymom0 wrote: post #55
Jackim wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I live in Ottawa and I assure you that this protest is not peaceful. I've had friends physically assaulted, spit on, and yelled at just for wearing a mask into a business. Not to mention the constant honking that was reaching levels above 100db inside people's homes. Homeless shelters were raided by protestors, businesses have been forced to close due to threats, and people are afraid to leave their homes.

I and my friends have been there for 3 weekends and haven't seen any of that. > Homeless shelters were raided by protestors, businesses have been forced to close due to threats, and people are afraid to leave their homes. This is hilariously inaccurate. Everyone's bringing food TO the truckers and there's so much food there that truckers are refusing to take more. Amazingly, we live in 2022 where everyone has a phone…

I'm happy that you haven't experienced any of that. None of what I said is untrue. I'm glad there has been lots of support from this protest to attempt to make up for some of the damage. It is still an illegal occupation that is costing my city millions every day, thousands of people are out of work at the Rideau Centre alone, libraries have been shut down, school children are being intimidated...

I'm happy you're having fun.

Re: Trudeau Invokes Emergencies Act

#89

Post by slibhb »

tedivm wrote: post #70
e4e78a06 wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Confiscating peoples' assets does not exactly engender you to a lot of political support. You're risking a massive loss in the next elections if you do that, just like how Democrats in the US are also facing huge electoral pressures on crime and COVID restrictions [1]. [1]: https://www.nytimes.com/2022/02/08/us/politics/new-york-mask...

This idea that there's a crime wave seems to be pushed here and on reddit by month old accounts with no real proof. The reality is that crime is down in most places. Lets look at San Francisco. I'm going to get my stats right from the San Francisco Police Department. Homocide - Down 20% Rape - Down 23.8% Robbery - Down 20.7% Assault - Down 8.8% Human Trafficking - Down 83.3% Burglary - Down 45.4% Motor Vehicle Theft…

> There is no real basis for this "crime wave" people keep talking about. That pressure is really just right wing propaganda.

Some "right wing propaganda" from the NYT: https://www.nytimes.com/2022/01/18/briefing/crime-surge-homi...

And WaPo: https://www.washingtonpost.com/nation/2022/01/21/homicide-ra...

And The Guardian: https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2021/sep/28/san-francisc...

Re: Trudeau Invokes Emergencies Act

#90

Post by TeeMassive »

karpierz wrote: post #68
vorpalhex wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I recommend reading up on Shay's rebellion from US history: https://www.history.com/topics/early-us/shays-rebellion The truckers assert their livelihoods are already heavily impacted. This crowd appears to be much larger than simply anti-vaxxers.

Shay's rebellion consisted of veterans, still armed with their weapons from the rebellion they'd fought a few years ago, at a time where the US government didn't have a standing army. I don't think those lessons quite transfer over here.

> at a time where the US government didn't have a standing army

Also at the time the government didn't have critical infrastructure

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