DoorDash is requiring engineers to deliver food • Hacker News Board

Re: DoorDash is requiring engineers to deliver food

#81

Post by Brian_K_White » Thu, Dec 30, 2021, 10:31 AM UTC

somethingAlex wrote: post #7

They did this at chick-fil-a corporate as well. An extremely competent product manager described the yearly experience as “standing around not knowing what I should do and trying not to get in the way.” Those kitchens get hectic, super different than being in the office.

That extremely competent product manager lacks imagination. I always learn things from watching users.

If anything the problem is I get too many ideas for things that could be improved and in reality you can't actually do a fraction of them.

But all this "extremely competent" guy gets out of it is "standing around not knowing what I should do"? What a joke.

Re: DoorDash is requiring engineers to deliver food

#82

Post by Brian_K_White » Thu, Dec 30, 2021, 10:36 AM UTC

The crybaby rationalizations are not only not a suprise, they aren't even clever.

The very people trying to invoke the value of their time, are in that very process exposing how valuable it actually isn't.

Re: DoorDash is requiring engineers to deliver food

#83

Post by StephenJGL » Thu, Dec 30, 2021, 12:54 PM UTC

valeness wrote: post #34

hallway_monitor wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Seems like a great way to filter out prima donnas who can't be bothered to put themselves in the place of their users. I would be happy to be rid of anyone complaining about this policy.

Can you explain to me how someone who spends their entire day in k8s and helm charts would benefit by exploring the UX of an application through the lens of the user? Beyond a normal study, that is?

I've run every one of my companies with some form of everyone participating at a user level regularly. Either through support or using the product. Each type of role gets something out of it. A k8s engineer can achieve more understanding of their mission and connection to how their seemingly siloed activity has a real world impact while more directly product focused roles might gain actual product insight. In my experience employees who genuinely care about what the company is seeking to achieve do gain something from the experience.

Re: DoorDash is requiring engineers to deliver food

#84

Post by Fire-Dragon-DoL » Thu, Dec 30, 2021, 12:59 PM UTC

Brian_K_White wrote: post #79

Fire-Dragon-DoL wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What if the engineer doesn't have a car or a disability? That would be a problem, if it's not on contract

Addressed in the article you must not have read yet somehow have opinions on.

Nope, sorry, i read only the first part. Thanks for addressing that

Re: DoorDash is requiring engineers to deliver food

#85

Post by xtiansimon » Thu, Dec 30, 2021, 2:13 PM UTC

windowsrookie wrote: post #15

Requiring the engineer to actually use the product they are working on in real life is good. Maybe it can help make the experience better for the dashers, the restaurants, and the company. That $400,000/yr engineer makes more money in a day than a DoorDash worker makes in 2 weeks working full time. I do not feel any sympathy for the 1 dash they will have to make a month.

400,000 / 52 = 7692.31 More like a month, if the dasher is lucky

Re: DoorDash is requiring engineers to deliver food

#86

Post by xtiansimon » Thu, Dec 30, 2021, 2:30 PM UTC

Nbox9 wrote: post #27

When designing a dogfooding process try not to have 50 engineers do the same thing 12 or 120 times a year. For example, having engineers in kitchens fulfilling orders, having engineers perform store management tasks, and having engineers run a full day of deliveries will probably provide more insights even if done less frequently. I’m pro dogfooding, but put some thought into making sure the entire app is being dogfo…

Speaking of dogfooding, let's not forget the restaurant's side of things. The DoorDash payout report is a $#!T show:

  TIMESTAMP_UTC_TIME, TIMESTAMP_UTC_DATE, TIMESTAMP_LOCAL_TIME, TIMESTAMP_LOCAL_DATE, PAYOUT_TIME, PAYOUT_DATE, STORE_ID, BUSINESS_ID, STORE_NAME, MERCHANT_STORE_ID, TRANSACTION_TYPE, TRANSACTION_ID, DOORDASH_ORDER_ID, MERCHANT_DELIVERY_ID, EXTERNAL_ID, DESCRIPTION, FINAL_ORDER_STATUS, CURRENCY, SUBTOTAL, TAX_SUBTOTAL, COMMISSION, COMMISSION_TAX_AMOUNT, DRIVE_CHARGE, MARKETING_FEES, DELIVERY_FEES, SMALL_ORDER_FEES, TAX_FEES, FLEXIBLE_FULFILLMENT_FEE, FLEXIBLE_FULFILLMENT_FEE_TAX, TIPS, CREDIT, DEBIT, DOORDASH_TRANSACTION_ID, PAYOUT_ID, TAX_REMITTED_BY_DOORDASH_TO_STATE, SUBTOTAL_FOR_TAX, DOORDASH_FUNDED_SUBTOTAL_DISCOUNT_AMOUNT, MERCHANT_FUNDED_SUBTOTAL_DISCOUNT_AMOUNT

What the heck is a 'TAX_FEES' anyway? You have taxes, or you have fees. Why use the terms 'CREDIT' and 'DEBIT'? Too clever by half.

What's worse is it doesn't add up correctly.

  SUBTOTAL + TAX_SUBTOTAL + DELIVERY_FEES + SMALL_ORDER_FEES + TIPS

  does not _always_ equal

  CREDIT + COMMISSION + DRIVE_CHARGE + MARKETING_FEES

Before DoorDash gobbled up Caviar, their report was different and terrible. Then they updated the report to what you see here, and it's better, but still terrible.