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Learn accounting for free

accountingcoach.com

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Re: Learn accounting for free

#81
post #24

Pardon my ignorance if any, but I find financials and accounting as quite boring things. Most problems in these are about tracing numbers, reconciliation and mismatches. What thril one can face in these areas? Any examples of challenges you see ?

Modern data processing is all about work flows and data flows, and accounting is gorged with that stuff.

There's a reason that there are 3000 different businesses, but 6000 different accounting packages. At a glance, they're all the same. But accounting data processing is all about the last mile. That 10% that the company does differently.

Now, when folks say "accounting" they typically mean General Ledger, Accounts Payable, and Account Receivable (GLAPAR as we called it). In truth, it's really about the General Ledger, everything is else is about feeding the GL. Most of the reports come from the GL.

GL is where all the numbers are tallied up. AP is stuff you owe people. AR is stuff people owes you. Then you have the distribution systems that tend to fee AP and AR. (Mind these are all broad strokes.)

Consider an Amazon order. You went to the site and ordered a radio and stick of deodorant. Honestly, the mind reels about the accounting impact of that order.

Amazon has to account for the money you're paying, the value of the goods sold, the taxes (potentially multiple jurisdictions), the shipping, and the credit card fees. Meanwhile, the costs of those goods include not just the value of the goods, the labor involved in taking off a truck, putting it on a shelf, taking it off a shelf and putting it on a truck. The cost of the box. The cost of the label.

ALL of that hits the GL in to its own slot, in its own account. The total number of GL entries for a single order is probably dozens, even for simple orders (no doubt it gets more fun with associates and folks selling through Amazon, etc. etc.). This is where all that chasing of imbalances happens. With double entry accounting, everything has to balance.

And worse, not only is it explosive in its detail, it can CHANGE, at any time! Business change their minds on how they track things, what they want to track, when they want to track. It could be marketing asking questions, it could be regulatory, it could be anything. It's a very dynamic environment.

At one place I had to rewrite pricing and discount logic every 6 months as they came up with new schemes. (Oh, and don't forget, all of the OLD schemes are still in play -- don't think you can forget about those when someone calls up 90 days later asking for a credit). And you'd think you could do something "generic". No. The marketing people are very creative.

At one place, a smaller business, probably cut 100 checks a week. They had a product canceled. Thousands of refunds. We had to run several large boxes of checks through the band printer. I can not convey to you briefly how impactful that process was. "Cutting a check", I hope you can imagine, is a very controlled process, and we had to stomp through the lot of the internal workflows to get that done. Lots of eyes were on the process. (Remember, the pre-printed check numbers had to match the transactions in the system, let's hope the paper doesn't jam.) Outside in, it seems stupid, boring, and silly. When you're in the thick of it, it's like a rocket launch. Lot of time invested it getting this all right.

As data processing people, we strive to manage complexity. Our job is to make the systems and processes accessible to the people who rely on them, and as well as adapt to their ever changing needs for the business.

Working back office accounting and distribution is a surprisingly target rich environment for interesting work that can be crushed in detail. But our job is to wrangle that.

You don't need to be an accountant to do this, but it's good to learn the vocabulary: debits, credits, journals, posting, agings, etc. etc.

And, finally, everyone does this. Having "accounting" experience pretty much qualifies you for all sorts of businesses. Each one you have to learn a little bit of domain knowledge, but the accounting terms themselves are a common grounding that gets your foot in the door. I've written systems for warehousing, meat brokers, paint shops, plant growers, auto parts, and magazine publishing, just as a start.

Honestly, it beats healthcare.

Re: Learn accounting for free

#82

I've never gotten the reconciliation of many of these "learn accounting" guides with what it takes to do actual accounting. They seem to make a big deal of covering very basic concepts that I would expect anybody with a programming background to pick up in under 10 minutes. The topics covered by these guides are less complex than most APIs. But when it comes time to do actual accounting, there is a whole host of much…

re: Quickbooks. It has now basically bifurcated into an online version and a desktop version, with somewhat different features. QB will in fact walk you through an optional setup interview to ask about what your general type of business is (service, retail, etc) and will create a default chart of accounts, which takes care of part of your need (how to categorize expenses). It becomes more complicated when the whole optional layer of "items" used to create invoices and bills gets added in. There is a fixed asset function, but QB is not really designed to calculate depreciation, rather it is normally handled with an annual journal entry based on output from the tax return.

It does have some frequent traps for new users, who for example often don't understand "undeposited funds" and end up double-counting their revenue. Or, they don't realize that when they transfer money from say checking to savings, the entry made in one account register is automatically reflected in the other.

Re: Learn accounting for free

#83
> You can access a corporation's Form 10-K by going to the Investor Relations section of the corporation's website[1]

Shameless plug: you can try https://Last10K.com to get 10-K annual reports aggregated in one site. This includes all financial statements (ex.Balance Sheets) broken out so you don't have to find them in a lengthy 10-K.

[1] https://www.accountingcoach.com/balance-sheet-new/explanatio...

Re: Learn accounting for free

#84

I've never gotten the reconciliation of many of these "learn accounting" guides with what it takes to do actual accounting. They seem to make a big deal of covering very basic concepts that I would expect anybody with a programming background to pick up in under 10 minutes. The topics covered by these guides are less complex than most APIs. But when it comes time to do actual accounting, there is a whole host of much…

Quickbooks uses double entry accounting at its core but hides it as single entry accounting (like Quicken) by presenting most UI as entries into registers that represent assets (like the checkbox register or invoices) or liabilities (like bills or credit cards) while hiding owner's equity behind a year-end closing dialog.

For example instead of having to learn what accounts to debit and credit when invoicing and then receiving payment from a customer you enter invoices in the invoice UI and receive payments in the receive payments and it takes care of the debits and credits for you.

You can use Quickbooks to directly do double entry accounting by entering company journal entries. You (or your bookkeeper/accountant) will do that for more complex transactions that don't have a dedicated UI like, for example, partially returning a damage deposit to a tenant with the remainder covering repairs needed.

I took a community college course in Accounting when I was thinking about enrolling in an MBA back in the '90s. You can learn the math in a really short amount of time - it is just basic addition/subtraction. It does take a while to get an intuitive feel as to why some things are debit normal and some are credit normal. Doing a bunch of "T" accounts will bake it into your brain. There are some good graphics here about that (first site I found while Googling) - https://corporatefinanceinstitute.com/resources/knowledge/ac...

Re: Learn accounting for free

#85

I've never gotten the reconciliation of many of these "learn accounting" guides with what it takes to do actual accounting. They seem to make a big deal of covering very basic concepts that I would expect anybody with a programming background to pick up in under 10 minutes. The topics covered by these guides are less complex than most APIs. But when it comes time to do actual accounting, there is a whole host of much…

Quickbooks uses double entry accounting at its core but hides it as single entry accounting (like Quicken) by presenting most UI as entries into registers that represent assets (like the checkbox register or invoices) or liabilities (like bills or credit cards) while hiding owner's equity behind a year-end closing dialog. For example instead of having to learn what accounts to debit and credit when invoicing and then…

So these "T accounts" are exactly the kind of thing I'm talking about. Reading that page they just seem to be a visual method to represent negative numbers, explained very verbosely? This seems like it might have been a really valuable invention for someone in 1494 or even 1894. But in 2021 when we're comfortable with defining rich semantic models, it just seems quaint and limiting. Like for instance as shown it leaves out the date, whether the transaction has tax relevance, a link to its corresponding second entry, etc.

I know this is apostasy, but even "double entry" itself feels this way to me, compared with say more freeform "tags". Like if you pay an expense for repairs, which may be tax deductible, then it seems the only way to represent that expense in strict double book is to have 2 accounts for (Repairs_Tax, Repairs_Notax). And it gets even worse when federal and state tax differ, or multiple states are involved. Whereas what I really want is for that single transaction to possibly show up in multiple expense categories, which are then later summed for specific reports.

Maybe my questions parallel the Lisp curse where arithmetic has gotten so easy I'm brushing off what I perceive to be overdiligent focus on shared mechanics? I just don't see what the traditional framework gets me, compared to how much people focus on it.

Re: Learn accounting for free

#86

I've never gotten the reconciliation of many of these "learn accounting" guides with what it takes to do actual accounting. They seem to make a big deal of covering very basic concepts that I would expect anybody with a programming background to pick up in under 10 minutes. The topics covered by these guides are less complex than most APIs. But when it comes time to do actual accounting, there is a whole host of much…

re: Quickbooks. It has now basically bifurcated into an online version and a desktop version, with somewhat different features. QB will in fact walk you through an optional setup interview to ask about what your general type of business is (service, retail, etc) and will create a default chart of accounts, which takes care of part of your need (how to categorize expenses). It becomes more complicated when the whole o…

I was using the offline version obviously, in a VM with no network access. I do recall some wizards for setting up accounts, but they weren't applicable to my business. It also didn't feel like such wizards would have changed the UI into operating at a higher level.

Re: Learn accounting for free

#87
post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Any advice for intermediate or advanced accounting? I studied finance in school, so I'm confident it the broad-strokes basics, but getting into deeper stuff is still intimidating.

I'm not sure of your starting point or your goals, but maybe: 1. Wood's Business Accounting 2 2. Some of the CFA study materials 3. Some of the 10kdiver threads: https://10kdiver.com/twitter-threads/ 4. Books about financial fraud (that talk about incorrect ways to do accounting). 5. IFRS standards for your industry. 6. Googling 'Accounting for X', where X is something to do with your industry (e.g. 'virtual goods' o…

One more thing - I think it's enlightening to, at least once, build financial statements from a set of transactions, and then to dig back from the summary, to the original transactions, i.e.

1. Export all the transactions from your accounting software (from the start of time, to the end of last month).

2. Export the chart of accounts from your accounting software.

3. Load these into two separate tabs in Excel.

4. Add a column to #1, that maps the account to the relevant account type (e.g. 'assets') and statement (BS or P&L), using #2 as a lookup table.

5. Create a pivot table from #1, to create a balance sheet.

6. Create another pivot table from #1, but this time use time (month or year) as a dimension.

7. See if you can relate some of the balance sheet and P&L values from your spreadsheet, with the values on the statements produced by your accounting software.

8. Assuming they match, go back to the balance sheet pivot table and double-click on one of the non-zero values. You will see a history of every transaction that changed that account.

Re: Learn accounting for free

#88
post #3

I'm a software engineer who moved into freelance consulting a few years ago (I do back-ends and front-ends for mobile and web, nothing finance specific other than occasional credit card payment integrations). It's been a roller-coaster in many regards and one of the highlights is having learned a lot about bookkeeping, taxes, financial planning and everything that comes with running a small business in general. (Aspe…

UK based, so YMMV. Moved from self-employed for the odd side gig, to UK LTD co, to VAT registered UK LTD co. The "business services mafia" will like to frighten you into believing you have to drop hundreds of £ on their services - plus £120/yr for an accounts package, more for payroll, business banking, etc. Because your mind is too tiny to comprehend the ways of the priests. e.g: Don't ever ask a question in a busin…

For a business account, Metro bank has no monthly charge if your balance stays above £6000, and only charges for some types of transactions (none of which I've used in the 6 years MyCo has been active).

Re: Learn accounting for free

#89
post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Presumably you'd have to pay back more than you get in the loan, right? Wouldn't your liability increase by more than a million dollars?

Not until the interest accrues. You could (no idea why you would) borrow $1MM and immediately pay it back before owing any interest. You would need to reflect this on your books but nothing material has changed.

> You could (no idea why you would) borrow $1MM and immediately pay it back before owing any interest.

Can you in fact do that? It's possible with a residential mortgage in the US, because there are laws prohibiting prepayment penalties. And I think even those don't apply to refinanced mortgages?

Re: Learn accounting for free

#90
post #54
post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This sounds like every interaction I've had asking a question in a plumbing/electrician forum. Oh, if you're asking that question your definitely going to poison your entire house with sewer gas and/or burn the place down with that wiring.

If you knew me you would understand why these warnings are necessary...

Warnings are most certainly necessary, but they should be accompanied by the actual answer, else GTFO.

It seems like these fields are filled with people who can't stand DIY and just try and get everyone to pay for professional services.

When I try and replace a burnt fuse and ask for help, I accept that I'm not a professional and might burn my house down. Just tell me the risks and how to do it. I'm not a child, and I'm not going to sue someone when I've said upfront that nobody becomes liable just because they gave me advice.

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