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Stockholm parents built their own school app, then the city called the cops

wired.co.uk

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Re: Stockholm parents built their own school app, then the city called the cops

#81

Post by ghaff »

hcrean wrote: post #60
Frondo wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I would ask the opposite question -- why is that an important number to conceal? (Please no "it's none of your business" replies, that doesn't really answer the question and it's not an interesting direction to go.)

There is an "ignorance is bliss" argument and a "if you don't know what is on offer, you can't ask for it" argument. The whole privacy system is geared towards supporting employers and people in the upper echelons of salary.

And yet, at least in the US, it's probably the people in the highest echelons of salary whose salaries are most public (in addition to public sector employees).

Re: Stockholm parents built their own school app, then the city called the cops

#82

Post by Loughla »

ghaff wrote: post #77
Loughla wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I still don't see a downside. If I know I am a better employee than you, and you make that much more, if I am unwilling to do anything about it but grumble, that's a personal problem. I would argue that anyone who is willing to stay in a shit situation without trying to remedy said situation (being underpaid and knowing it for a fact) sort of brought those problems on themselves. It's a problem to complain about only…

It boils down to what people consider personal information. I don't especially want to share this information (nor lots of other things about my personal life) and that's my decision to make absent public policy that goes in a different direction. So it's a downside to me simply because I don't think my salary or many other things are any of your business. Also you don't know you're a better employee than me. You thi…

That's fair. I think we just have a basic difference in what should be everyone's business. I don't want my address out in the world, but I have zero problems with my salary and job for public consumption.

>Also you don't know you're a better employee than me. You think you are but you may not even be aware of a bunch of stuff I do

This is actually still a pro-, in my opinion, on public salary information. If I know you make more and approach the manager, it opens up a line of discussion on expectations versus outcomes versus perceptions. I think it actually makes the process of helping staff improve much easier!

Re: Stockholm parents built their own school app, then the city called the cops

#83

Post by Diggsey »

wonderwonder wrote: post #50
jacobolus wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Active involvement = parent teaches child various skills and ideas, reads books aloud, suggests interesting problems to solve, works together with them on extra-curricular projects, obtains materials and resources related to the child’s personal interests, ... Micromanaging the completion of their school-assigned busywork is something different.

I don't know if you have kids, I am guessing not, if I am wrong, my apologies. Knowing what your kids have due for school is not micromanaging its a core part of being a good parent. I know if my kid has a math test so it lets me sit down with him and review for his test, it allows me to ensure he knows the basis for whatever comes next in his curriculum. Terribly overbearing parents are not good but I think people a…

That's absolutely micromanaging and negative.

The goal of school isn't just to pass the tests. If a kid fails to revise for a test, but it doesn't matter because their parent will just look up the schedule and force them to revise, then they learn nothing beyond what's in the test.

If they fail to revise and as a result do badly at the test, then next time they might actually take the initiative and revise through their own motivation, and that's a far more valuable skill than anything that might actually be in the test.

Re: Stockholm parents built their own school app, then the city called the cops

#84

Post by striking »

soco wrote: post #55
striking wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It appears to manage attendance and grades among other things. I'm not sure what this has to do with Chromebooks.

There are different schools of thought, some people would rather have the kids home-schooled or completely different like Montessori, Steiner... so maybe the critique comes from that direction.

Yeah, but what does that have to do with a school app?

Re: Stockholm parents built their own school app, then the city called the cops

#85

Post by moffkalast »

newbamboo wrote: post #71
wonderwonder wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't know if you have kids, I am guessing not, if I am wrong, my apologies. Knowing what your kids have due for school is not micromanaging its a core part of being a good parent. I know if my kid has a math test so it lets me sit down with him and review for his test, it allows me to ensure he knows the basis for whatever comes next in his curriculum. Terribly overbearing parents are not good but I think people a…

I think it’s good to be involved but an app that passes information to the parent, essentially bypassing the child, is disempowering to the child. The child should know and be able to tell you she has a math test. If she is not good at managing that sort of thing, then she needs to get better. Using an app to circumvent the child’s own management of that stuff is at least similar to micromanaging.

And quite the opposite, it reinforces the idea that they don't need to remember it so they never will.

Re: Stockholm parents built their own school app, then the city called the cops

#86

Post by ftrobro »

wingerlang wrote: post #72
arp242 wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Wait, who publishes this information, and why? Address/phone is somewhat standard phonebook stuff (or at least, used to be; less so now I guess) but job and salary?!

Where is job and salary noted? I don't think it is, just taxes paid. At least that's what I understand ratsit has (never ACTUALLY looked at it though).

In paper:

https://www.ratsit.se/ratsitkatalogen

Re: Stockholm parents built their own school app, then the city called the cops

#87

Post by tata71 »

wonderwonder wrote: post #16
raxxorrax wrote: post #8

> In some cases, people’s personal information could be accessed from Google searches. SEO providers should take a note here. > It warned parents to stop using the app and alleged that it might be illegally accessing people’s personal information If your API allows data extraction, it probably isn't a fault of any client. Perhaps they meant that creators could steal credentials. A problem with any software. I think t…

"I think this digital child managing system sounds moderately dystopian to be honest" I disagree, I have 2 kids in elementary school and it is very useful to be able to look up what the kids have scheduled for the day to determine what to dress them in, see what's for lunch and if I need to pack them something if they won't like the available option. Most importantly though its very helpful to look up what homework /…

> its very helpful to look up what homework / tests are due as the kids tend to not manage this so well themselves

How do you expect they'll develop these sorts of self-starter skills and mental models, besides experiencing things like the (comparatively low-impact!) consequences of not handing in your 5th grade homework....?

Hopefully you're going full parabola and also providing disproportionately strong incentives to do the "right" behaviors, because otherwise it's as likely they'll succeed as they'll become sand through your tight grasp.

Re: Stockholm parents built their own school app, then the city called the cops

#89

Post by tata71 »

Symbiote wrote: post #65
wonderwonder wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't know if you have kids, I am guessing not, if I am wrong, my apologies. Knowing what your kids have due for school is not micromanaging its a core part of being a good parent. I know if my kid has a math test so it lets me sit down with him and review for his test, it allows me to ensure he knows the basis for whatever comes next in his curriculum. Terribly overbearing parents are not good but I think people a…

Active involvement would be talking to your children and asking them what they have for school . Looking up their schedule on a website is passive involvement. I'm relieved these systems didn't exist when I was a child.

(Reading about people) breaking Blackboard et al was some of the best fun in school days....

Re: Stockholm parents built their own school app, then the city called the cops

#90

Post by Entalpi »

locallost wrote: post #29

> The platform is a complex system that’s made up of three different parts, containing 18 individual modules that are maintained by five external companies. The sprawling system is used by 600 preschools and 177 schools, with separate logins for every teacher, student, and parent. The only problem? It doesn’t work. > The Skolplattform, which has cost more than 1 billion Swedish Krona, SEK, ($117 million), has failed…

Rather its that the goverment funded development resulted in a bad product. People reimplementing it in a their spare time resulted in an even better product.
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