Barcelona’s Bicibús: hundreds of families biking to school together • Hacker News Board

Re: Barcelona’s Bicibús: hundreds of families biking to school together

#81

Post by sandermvanvliet » Sun, Oct 24, 2021, 6:44 PM UTC

Tade0 wrote: post #71

robomartin wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

https://www.dutchnews.nl/news/2021/09/cycling-injuries-three... From the article: "VeiligheidNL estimates that there were actually some 80,000 injuries of which 50,000 were serious." And, of course, the idea of biking and the reality of it are quite different things: https://www.bikelaw.com/2019/05/amsterdam-not-cycling-paradi... I love how people tend to have this impulse to reduce reality to a single variable: Bike…

FTA: > Often a faster biker would pass within millimeters to get by me as I pedaled in an already narrow bike lane. This is the number one thing I hate about mixing sidewalks with bike paths, but it appears it's also an issue on the latter. Anyway this figure representing the fraction of trips done by bike in the Netherlands is interesting in context: https://www2.deloitte.com/xe/en/insights/focus/future-of-mob... Lo…

I live in Rotterdam and don’t drive my car in the city anymore, only to go out of the city. We’ve had quite a few changes with reduction in lanes (2 to 1) to allow less traffic in to reduce the air pollution and by doing that bike lanes got bigger which I think is a good thing. It makes driving a car in the city less attractive and while I have no idea if more people ride bikes now, from my limited perspective it does seem to be the case

Re: Barcelona’s Bicibús: hundreds of families biking to school together

#82

Post by mejutoco » Sun, Oct 24, 2021, 6:51 PM UTC

ResearchCode wrote: post #66

doctorhandshake wrote: post #20

Yet another example of how Barcelona feels societally futuristic in some ways. For a couple more - they were way ahead of the curve (at least from an American perceptive) on superblocks[1] and they have centralized vacuum municipal trash collection[2] [1] https://www.theguardian.com/cities/2016/may/17/superblocks-r... [2] https://enviropaul.wordpress.com/2016/03/22/all-the-garbage-...

It feels more dystopian than futuristic. There are countries where children don't have to commute in large groups to avoid crime.

Barcelona is not a place where children have to commute in large groups to avoid crime. I do not know where you got that idea.

Re: Barcelona’s Bicibús: hundreds of families biking to school together

#83

Post by ResearchCode » Sun, Oct 24, 2021, 6:52 PM UTC

mejutoco wrote: post #82

ResearchCode wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It feels more dystopian than futuristic. There are countries where children don't have to commute in large groups to avoid crime.

Barcelona is not a place where children have to commute in large groups to avoid crime. I do not know where you got that idea.

Got the idea from them being one of the crime capitals of Europe where visitors are asked to practice war zone vigilance.

Could also be a little bit of the middle class being priced out of driving cars.

Futurism in the Davos sense perhaps. You will own nothing...

Re: Barcelona’s Bicibús: hundreds of families biking to school together

#84

Post by peoplefromibiza » Sun, Oct 24, 2021, 6:53 PM UTC

_nalply wrote: post #50

I have been in Paris two weeks ago and I am surprised how much Paris changed in the last years. Bike lanes and people who ride bikes and scooters everywhere. I hope that this is THE change in most European metropolises for the future. Not only in Barcelona.

Been in Paris two weeks ago as well to visit my girlfriend who's been living there for 11 years.

Scooters are in the process of being banned in Paris because they are too dangerous and in Rome, where I come from, they are going yo be heavily regulated (mandatory helmet, reduced speed, designated pick up and drop locations, etc. ) because they caused a +35% increase of brain traumas to teenagers

Not everything that looks cool on first sight it's an actual improvement.

Re: Barcelona’s Bicibús: hundreds of families biking to school together

#85

Post by jseban » Sun, Oct 24, 2021, 7:05 PM UTC

tpm wrote: post #80

jseban wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah well, in this example and many similar big cities in europe, you have subway and buses that will take you to any street corner. Sure, in a small town in australia or the US, not the case, but I highly doubt bike lanes will be any viable alternative there anyway. My point is that it's not a good idea to expand bike lanes in big city centers where you already have public transport, especially not in places that do…

> My point is that it's not a good idea to expand bike lanes in big city centers where you already have public transport I don't know what is your background, but many cities are doing it and it's not only about enabling bikes but also to disable passenger cars, and the main reason is it makes the places more livable and enjoyable: it's quieter, the air is cleaner, the streets are safer, people actually spend more ti…

My background is that I've cycled my whole life, all of childhood in rain and snow and later I've cycled for a few years in a big city. But I started to use it less and less, and now it's just parked and unused. And the reason is that there's always a better alternative. If the weather is nice, I drive an electric moped, it's not noisy or polluting, and it doesn't take up much space. And it's so so much better than cycling, I arrive much quicker and with more energy anywhere I go, and I can use the whole existing road network. And when the weather is bad, obviously public transport wins. I think the future is electric and self driving vehicles, not cycling, and being forced to propel yourself manually like that for basic transportation has no place in a modern world except for enjoyment, and this can be done in designated areas.

If you just want to avoid cars and have a more leisurely space, why not designate pedestrian zones like traditionally done in city centers, and use the space for cafés, market stands etc.

Re: Barcelona’s Bicibús: hundreds of families biking to school together

#86

Post by peoplefromibiza » Sun, Oct 24, 2021, 7:07 PM UTC

branko_d wrote: post #54

inglor_cz wrote: post #3

It is my experience that two things correlate positively with widespread adoption of biking: a. Relatively flat city terrain. (Not the case in Prague, for example; a lot of the residential areas are at much higher elevation than the city centre.) b. Moderate temperatures at both ends of the summer-winter scale. Most people won't bike to work at -20 or +35 Celsius.

Subzero temperatures don't seem to be that much of a problem, as the Finnish city of Oulu shows us: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oulu "Oulu is notable for its transportation network dedicated to non-motor vehicular traffic, including pedestrians and bicycles (termed "light" traffic in Finland). In 2010, the city contained more than 600 kilometres (370 mi) of pathways and more than 100 underpasses and bridges devot…

> the Finnish city of Oulu

seaside resort of 208,939 inhabitants

Many cities have roads and bridges only devoted to light traffic, the real issue is that they are not excellent for biking. In many large cities the biggest problem is distances.

Sub zero temperatures are an issue even for professional bikers at Tour de France.

When the road conditions are not uniform and distances are longer than a few minutes ride they can cause serious problems.

For example imagine going uphill and then down, exposed to the chilling weather and the consequences on a casual bike user.

Re: Barcelona’s Bicibús: hundreds of families biking to school together

#87

Post by asdfwefdadsf » Sun, Oct 24, 2021, 7:09 PM UTC

ResearchCode wrote: post #83

mejutoco wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Barcelona is not a place where children have to commute in large groups to avoid crime. I do not know where you got that idea.

Got the idea from them being one of the crime capitals of Europe where visitors are asked to practice war zone vigilance. Could also be a little bit of the middle class being priced out of driving cars. Futurism in the Davos sense perhaps. You will own nothing...

Please provide a source for Barcelona being a crime capital of Europe.

Re: Barcelona’s Bicibús: hundreds of families biking to school together

#88

Post by ResearchCode » Sun, Oct 24, 2021, 7:10 PM UTC

asdfwefdadsf wrote: post #87

ResearchCode wrote: post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Got the idea from them being one of the crime capitals of Europe where visitors are asked to practice war zone vigilance. Could also be a little bit of the middle class being priced out of driving cars. Futurism in the Davos sense perhaps. You will own nothing...

Please provide a source for Barcelona being a crime capital of Europe.

For instance, the "sources" accessible through those keywords put in a google search query.

(Entertaining the question as if my claim was more controversial than any other in this thread, that is, as if Barcelona was not infamous as a crime ridden s hole where visitors are asked to practice war zone vigilance.)

Re: Barcelona’s Bicibús: hundreds of families biking to school together

#89

Post by jseban » Sun, Oct 24, 2021, 7:13 PM UTC

tpm wrote: post #80

jseban wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah well, in this example and many similar big cities in europe, you have subway and buses that will take you to any street corner. Sure, in a small town in australia or the US, not the case, but I highly doubt bike lanes will be any viable alternative there anyway. My point is that it's not a good idea to expand bike lanes in big city centers where you already have public transport, especially not in places that do…

> My point is that it's not a good idea to expand bike lanes in big city centers where you already have public transport I don't know what is your background, but many cities are doing it and it's not only about enabling bikes but also to disable passenger cars, and the main reason is it makes the places more livable and enjoyable: it's quieter, the air is cleaner, the streets are safer, people actually spend more ti…

Oh and I should add: outside of my house they have blocked one whole lane of the road from cars and designated it for cyclists. There was already a smaller bike lane. This new lane is now mostly empty and the remaining two lanes have traffic jams now with sirens all the time because emergency vehicles can't pass anymore. And I just think it's stupid and annoying. There was already a perfectly fine bike lane. There is also a tram. Why expand that bike lane now and cause traffic jams, I don't understand. Seems like it's just for virtue signalling, oh look how modern we are and such good people, when in practice it's barely used, not needed and cause traffic jams.

Re: Barcelona’s Bicibús: hundreds of families biking to school together

#90

Post by mrexroad » Sun, Oct 24, 2021, 7:20 PM UTC

ResearchCode wrote: post #83

mejutoco wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Barcelona is not a place where children have to commute in large groups to avoid crime. I do not know where you got that idea.

Got the idea from them being one of the crime capitals of Europe where visitors are asked to practice war zone vigilance. Could also be a little bit of the middle class being priced out of driving cars. Futurism in the Davos sense perhaps. You will own nothing...

?? I spent 3 months studying there a while back. To me, Barcelona felt safer there than most large American cities that I’ve lived in. One “problem” was petty crime that seemed to mostly target tourists—-vigilance was indeed the solution… but more of “mind your surroundings” than “war zone.”