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Google drops engineering residency after protests over ‘inequities’

cnbc.com

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Re: Google drops engineering residency after protests over ‘inequities’

#81

Post by ashhdsfsa28378 »

anonygler wrote: post #9

That's insane. The residency program is a way for people from unique backgrounds to enter into the software engineering field with less stringent interview requirements. SWE can pay upwards of $500-600k after 5-10 years of experience. This was an incredible opportunity and it's an absolute shame that internal protests killed it. Yes, you get less pay and a smaller stock refresh, but I know a few people who's careers…

To clarify, I can say from experience (having personally helped convert 6 engineering residents at Google), I'm pretty confident the "less pay and a smaller stock refresh" in the article is referring to conversion offers to FTE and stock refreshes after the first year of FTE employment, not to their pay during their residency. Those FTE conversion offers were terrible, from what I saw, with no room for negotiation. The residency program had given these candidates 1 year to build a proven track record of performance and they were fully ramped up by the end, so there was no risk to Google at the time of those offers; if a resident was given an offer, it was because they were a pretty sure thing (far more than any normal interviewed hire). As such, I think their offers should have been higher than a regular hire, not lower. (As someone who was hired direct out of college with little experience, I can confidently say the offers my residents got were _significantly_ lower than my starting offer at the same level.) The article states this a bit unclearly, but I'm pretty sure this is what it means, because it doesn't make sense to refer to year-end bonuses or stock refreshes during residency because they aren't long enough to get these regardless (and I never heard anyone complain about this).

That said, as a side note, I do think articles like this tend to sensationalize Google as a whole as the "bad guy". Try to remember, Google is a huge company with lots of people managing its many parts. I personally feel there was a failing here, but if so, it was the fault of a relatively small number of people, not "Google". Even most of the people running this program were good, and the program itself was great (as you said) other than what I said above. There's hundreds of thousands of decisions happening every day at Google. If just a couple bad ones get to define the company as a whole, then no large company can ever be good, no matter how good all the rest of those decisions are.

Re: Google drops engineering residency after protests over ‘inequities’

#82

Post by disgruntledphd2 »

rejectedandsad wrote: post #56
anonygler wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not about you. It's about amazon and their treatment of you. I've worked with exceptional engineers who did a tour in Amazon and I have nothing but respect for the people who work there. But I would never work for Amazon because of the abusive PIP culture (and the leadership principles shite omfg). Cheer up. And if you're not happy there, move on to a place with a name you're proud of.

I honestly would, just because of how we seem to be perceived by the labor market (considering I make less than a Google new grad as a SDE2) but otherwise I don't really have any complaints. Sadly, I think I've reached my peak intellectual potential, and even that was through an easy way (doing an internship and getting a conversion offer). I'd never be able to pass Google HC, and haven't before because I simply don'…

Dude, Google have 100,000 employees. They can't all be Mensa level IQ.

Re: Google drops engineering residency after protests over ‘inequities’

#83

Post by junon »

anonygler wrote: post #9

That's insane. The residency program is a way for people from unique backgrounds to enter into the software engineering field with less stringent interview requirements. SWE can pay upwards of $500-600k after 5-10 years of experience. This was an incredible opportunity and it's an absolute shame that internal protests killed it. Yes, you get less pay and a smaller stock refresh, but I know a few people who's careers…

> SWE can pay upwards of $500-600k after 5-10 years of experience.

Where? lol

Re: Google drops engineering residency after protests over ‘inequities’

#84

Post by nivenkos »

junon wrote: post #83
anonygler wrote: post #9

That's insane. The residency program is a way for people from unique backgrounds to enter into the software engineering field with less stringent interview requirements. SWE can pay upwards of $500-600k after 5-10 years of experience. This was an incredible opportunity and it's an absolute shame that internal protests killed it. Yes, you get less pay and a smaller stock refresh, but I know a few people who's careers…

> SWE can pay upwards of $500-600k after 5-10 years of experience. Where? lol

Here in Europe you're unlikely to break $100k in that time.

Re: Google drops engineering residency after protests over ‘inequities’

#85

Post by throwaways885 »

temporalparts wrote: post #49
MikeUt wrote: post #3

> Critics have long argued that Google and its tech industry peers favor white, Asian and male workers Google was 51.7% white in 2020, down from 54.4% in 2019 *. The US is 61.5% white, meaning whites are under-represented at Google, and increasingly so. How can one then argue they are favored? Why do reporters not apply even the smallest degree of scrutiny to such claims? * https://diversity.google/annual-report/

I think it's worth considering the following points: * The critics are talking about Software Engineering (~1/3rd of the company?), whereas the source you cited is about all of Google. I wouldn't be surprised if the White/Asian/Male splits are far worse when you only look at software engineers. * Google has many international offices (e.g. there's > 1000 employees in Google Japan).

> The critics are talking about Software Engineering (~1/3rd of the company?)

It's closer to 2/3.

Re: Google drops engineering residency after protests over ‘inequities’

#86

Post by concordDance »

JorkJork wrote: post #69
patmorgan23 wrote: post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The James demore event is another data point here. His "misogynist manifesto" basically said that google should implement policies that make the workplace better for everyone not just women or whatever minority. I believe one suggestion was to be more flexible with work hours and work from home. This policy helps everyone but has the biggest impact on mother's.

The "James demore event" was a guy arguing that some of his coworkers were less-than-qualified because they were women. This is wrong and actual misogyny, and does not get a pass because he framed it as a debate.

> The "James demore event" was a guy arguing that some of his coworkers were less-than-qualified because they were women.

That does not match my recollection. Did you read his memo or just second hand reports of it?

Re: Google drops engineering residency after protests over ‘inequities’

#87

Post by whoooooo123 »

SuoDuanDao wrote: post #33
akomtu wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What degree of purity is required to count as a European? Europeans can and do mix with non-europeans.

Under US law, 'one drop of blood' is sufficient to count as nonwhite. Might be an outgrowth of puritanism, I'm not sure.

That was only true in some states during Jim Crow. Others had different definitions of "white". In fact it was possible for some "black" people to become "white" just by crossing a state boundary.

Racism is stupid.

Re: Google drops engineering residency after protests over ‘inequities’

#88

Post by sneak »

b20000 wrote: post #70
JorkJork wrote: post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's bold to assume that the Google interview process accepts all qualified applicants.

bold? as long as there is no discrimination going on they can do what they want. the problem is, there is plenty of discrimination going on. maybe you don’t care because you work there. good for you. sooner or later, it will matter to you.

Discrimination against all but protected classes (eg race, religion, et c) is not only legal but standard practice; when hiring SWEs you want to discriminate against the inexperienced, those bad at code, et c.

Re: Google drops engineering residency after protests over ‘inequities’

#89

Post by torhorway »

junon wrote: post #83
anonygler wrote: post #9

That's insane. The residency program is a way for people from unique backgrounds to enter into the software engineering field with less stringent interview requirements. SWE can pay upwards of $500-600k after 5-10 years of experience. This was an incredible opportunity and it's an absolute shame that internal protests killed it. Yes, you get less pay and a smaller stock refresh, but I know a few people who's careers…

> SWE can pay upwards of $500-600k after 5-10 years of experience. Where? lol

[dead]

Re: Google drops engineering residency after protests over ‘inequities’

#90

Post by sydthrowaway »

junon wrote: post #83
anonygler wrote: post #9

That's insane. The residency program is a way for people from unique backgrounds to enter into the software engineering field with less stringent interview requirements. SWE can pay upwards of $500-600k after 5-10 years of experience. This was an incredible opportunity and it's an absolute shame that internal protests killed it. Yes, you get less pay and a smaller stock refresh, but I know a few people who's careers…

> SWE can pay upwards of $500-600k after 5-10 years of experience. Where? lol

Refreshers stacking + stock appreciation, I'd guess.
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