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VMWare Screw Customers

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81–90 of 93 posts

Re: VMWare Screw Customers

#81

Post by mjb »

schiptsov wrote: post #75

Why use proprietary (less tested, less stable) solutions while there is community-tested and community-supported ones? ^_^ People still stuck with a stereotype that most brilliant programmers work for corporations. This is, obviously, not true. Most of corporations outsource their R&D and QA and spend for marketing instead. That is a very common strategy. Now tell me - how this strategy correlates with a quality of a…

> One cannot compete with Linux (Ubuntu/RHEL/CentOS) communities in matters of testing and code quality. No code is better tested than those included in mainstream kernel or a polular distribution.

I know I'm feeding the troll here, but that is just naive.

There are many great open-source projects with terrific code quality, like parts of (and certainly not the whole of) the Linux kernel. There are also many commercial solutions which are far ahead of anything available in the open source world. In many spaces it makes great sense to use a proprietary solution over an open source one.

> Oracle vs. MySQL is a very good example - high quality community code is usually much better and well tested. (hint: it is about comparing the code quality, not a feature lists)

Can you provide evidence that MySQL has fewer important bugs than Oracle? I have used both fairly extensively and have noticed more bugs with MySQL, but that's just one anecdote.

> Most of corporations outsource their R&D and QA and spend for marketing instead.

Do you have evidence that vmware development is outsourced? Do you have evidence that outsourcing leads to a lower quality product? Most studies in this area have shown quality be lower with a push to lower costs, with no correlation to outsourcing.

Re: VMWare Screw Customers

#83

Post by jlawer »

wmf wrote: post #73
jlawer wrote: post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, but its not surprising that converting from a .net codebase to a java code base takes a few years.... they should have just re-written from scratch.... Once RHEV-3.0 is released though RHAT will open source it, so watch the product grow at that point, just like KVM has been growing in leaps and bounds recently. I say that as someone who was part of the RHEV support team at launch.... RHEV 2 was a mistake. Red H…

Is that what they're doing? I thought maybe the new RHEV manager would be built on oVirt.

Would you believe I heard something being bandied around about a $200 bit of software that converted c# code to java... and then have the devs fix the 20% that didn't convert.... I kid you not....

There was also talk about bringing in parts of the JBOSS stack... and I am not exactly sure why... but synergy might have something to do with it.

RHEV 3 will use more oVirt developed technologies (libvirt, etc) but now they have Enterprise customers who need compatibility for an extended period... so its going to be the ugly stepchild of RHEV2 (aka Qumranet's Product) and oVirt (redhats R&D). I suspect that RHEV is going to be carrying around baggage for a while.

Re: VMWare Screw Customers

#86

Post by wazoox »

ssmoot wrote: post #28
wazoox wrote: post #23

I know this is getting old, but here's another nice example of why you should be using Free Software for everything that's really important. KVM works very well; I know it misses some of the nice, pretty interfaces but at least it won't stab you in the back at the next upgrade.

I have two iSCSI Targets. I want to pull a LUN from each, and mirror on the KVM Host system, exposing the mirrored disks for my guests. Compared to using ZFS on OpenSolaris with Xen 3.1, this process is incredibly cumbersome and unreliable. Plus I just don't get the need for libvirt. It seems an incredibly complex and useless abstraction over a simply documented configuration file for Guests, and a tool to start/stop…

> I have two iSCSI Targets. I want to pull a LUN from each, and mirror on the KVM Host system, exposing the mirrored disks for my guests. Compared to using ZFS on OpenSolaris with Xen 3.1, this process is incredibly cumbersome and unreliable.

I don't see the relation with KVM. There is nothing special in the way it uses open-iscsi or mdadm to access iSCSI targets and set up mirrors. Maybe you're unfamiliar with these Linux-specific tools and mistakenly attribute to KVM your difficulties which are really Linux problems.

> Plus I just don't get the need for libvirt.

I don't use libvirt; I wrote a couple of scripts that allow me to do what I need with KVM. libvirt is useful only if you need to manage a whole lot of VMs.

Re: VMWare Screw Customers

#88

Post by ssmoot »

wazoox wrote: post #86
ssmoot wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have two iSCSI Targets. I want to pull a LUN from each, and mirror on the KVM Host system, exposing the mirrored disks for my guests. Compared to using ZFS on OpenSolaris with Xen 3.1, this process is incredibly cumbersome and unreliable. Plus I just don't get the need for libvirt. It seems an incredibly complex and useless abstraction over a simply documented configuration file for Guests, and a tool to start/stop…

> I have two iSCSI Targets. I want to pull a LUN from each, and mirror on the KVM Host system, exposing the mirrored disks for my guests. Compared to using ZFS on OpenSolaris with Xen 3.1, this process is incredibly cumbersome and unreliable. I don't see the relation with KVM. There is nothing special in the way it uses open-iscsi or mdadm to access iSCSI targets and set up mirrors. Maybe you're unfamiliar with these…

No, I'm aware they're Linux problems. It just seems the mind-share is on KVM these days so I generally consider Linux Host Virtualization == KVM.

You're absolutely correct though. It's not really KVM's fault. It's the Linux iscsi, software RAID, and volume management capabilities that are so lacking.

It just happens that that makes using KVM much less appealing.

I want:

  1. Reliable Snapshots and Replication
  2. Simple Volume Management
  3. Human readable device names
  4. Consistency of volumes/devices between reboots
  5. An "uncorruptable" FS backing the guests
  6. Reliable Virtualization
OpenSolaris is the only platform I know addresses these concerns. Linux doesn't come close despite it feeling like it's virtualization options are more mature.

FreeBSD may be a good fit with VirtualBox, but VBox on OpenSolaris and OpenIndiana was unstable for me at least. I'd like to give FreeBSD a try sometime.

On libvirt, that's about what I expected. I guess I just wanted to complain about it in general. ;-)

  sudo xm new /my/config/file
  sudo xm start my_guest
  sudo xm shutdown my_guest
  sudo xm delete my_guest
What's going through my head: "I need a tool that I haven't seen a decent one page explanation on to wrap that why?" :-)

Re: VMWare Screw Customers

#89

Post by cultureulterior »

diziet wrote: post #71
cultureulterior wrote: post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Depends on how large that organization is, and how much IT junk, like mail, etc.. is outsourced. (I'm sole sysadmin for a search engine, and I handle 200 servers.)

What search engine?

picsearch.com

Re: VMWare Screw Customers

#90

Post by schiptsov »

dave1010uk wrote: post #78
schiptsov wrote: post #75

Why use proprietary (less tested, less stable) solutions while there is community-tested and community-supported ones? ^_^ People still stuck with a stereotype that most brilliant programmers work for corporations. This is, obviously, not true. Most of corporations outsource their R&D and QA and spend for marketing instead. That is a very common strategy. Now tell me - how this strategy correlates with a quality of a…

Has anyone had any experience with VMware's products being untested or unstable? I've heard annectodally that VMware's hypervisor is miles ahead of the others in terms of performance and useful features. Does anyone have any info on this?

I have seen crashed ESX servers with unreadable error messages while no information or support except PR and forums full of new users trying to convince themselves they did right choice. (post-purchase rationalizations).
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