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Evidence from leaked account data on how elites use offshore banking [pdf]

brookings.edu

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Re: Evidence from leaked account data on how elites use offshore banking [pdf]

#81

Post by SvenMarquardt »

Swizec wrote: post #51
ajsnigrutin wrote: post #38

That's why i'm against high taxes. We get a bunch of random political parties, promising to "tax the rich" and stuff, we get new laws... and what happens? - The poor already pay very little tax - no change there - The rich avoid the tax by doing shady stuff (who remembers the panama papers.. or this.. or many other stories like these) - I, the middle class engineer get fucked by the taxes, and I get fucked hard, and…

> I, the middle class engineer get fucked by the taxes Fwiw we feel like middle class but we’re really in the top 5% or higher. We’re the rich people these taxes and politicians talk about. The ultra rich/wealthy are a red herring, there’s only a few 10k of them of them. Only 614 people are billionaires. 7 figure income (salary) puts you in top 0.35% ... that’s 1,120,000 Americans. Not a whole lot. edit: top 10% star…

You need to reframe it. How many $ do the top 0.35% own vs the next 5%.

Re: Evidence from leaked account data on how elites use offshore banking [pdf]

#82

Post by modo_mario »

Trias11 wrote: post #42
AlexandrB wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do you think there's any level of taxation where a wealthy individual wouldn't want to do some "tax avoidance" in another jurisdiction? I suspect there is not.

The lower the tax - the more money will stay and will be reinvested into the local economy. That should be easy to understand. Just as robbing productive people with taxes is not going to work.

>The lower the tax - the more money will stay and will be reinvested into the local economy.

The less progressive the tax and the less it's properly enforced the more inequality will occur. Poor and middleclass more effectively stimulate the economy with an equal amount of consumption simply due to the nature of what they spend it on and their quantity.

>Just as robbing productive people with taxes is not going to work.

How many of these are super productive, hardworking and/or smart to such an extent that their hard work and/or wonderful decision-making proportionally matches their wealth compared to you know your average middleclass engineers, programmers, medium and small business owners or the like. I'd estimate the percentage to be very small. And if their wealth somehow matches their productivity proportionally and above a certain amount quantifiable as ridiculously wealthy i'd start wondering where in the superhero universe these people fit.

Re: Evidence from leaked account data on how elites use offshore banking [pdf]

#83

Post by Gibbon1 »

throwaway77388 wrote: post #74
ajsnigrutin wrote: post #38

That's why i'm against high taxes. We get a bunch of random political parties, promising to "tax the rich" and stuff, we get new laws... and what happens? - The poor already pay very little tax - no change there - The rich avoid the tax by doing shady stuff (who remembers the panama papers.. or this.. or many other stories like these) - I, the middle class engineer get fucked by the taxes, and I get fucked hard, and…

IMO the high taxes should be only for people worth tens of millions of dollars or more.

Those high taxes were never about revenue, they were all about keeping corporate managers from looting the companies that employed them.

Re: Evidence from leaked account data on how elites use offshore banking [pdf]

#84

Post by guerrilla »

macinjosh wrote: post #66
guerrilla wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This doesn't seem to make much sense: You're against a policy because someone lied and didn't implement it when they said they would? You can be for taxing the rich and against people who do otherwise simultaneously.

I think the point is that beyond total and complete global totalitarianism there isn't a great way for any government to truly tax the rich to the extent desired because there were always be another safe haven for it overseas.

> there isn't a great way for any government to truly tax the rich

The burden of proof is on you then. For you to be able to say that, you'd have to enumerate all possibilities and then provide evidence why each wouldn't work. In the meantime, it seems obvious things could be better without needing to be perfect.

Re: Evidence from leaked account data on how elites use offshore banking [pdf]

#85

Post by Trias11 »

ceejayoz wrote: post #49
Trias11 wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So what would be a single reason for person with $100MM of wealth to give $25MM away to wasteful, corruptive government? What kind of benefits the person is gaining by buying $25MM worth of taxes? I thought so too. Give that person a chance to reinvest these money into local economy, growing productive businesses instead of slapping the "filthy rich" label and suddenly there is a lots of capital are used for everyone…

> What kind of benefits the person is gaining by buying $25MM worth of taxes? Avoiding guillotines?

I mean carrots, not sticks.

People would be happy to pay 100% in tax to avoid guillotine but how much of a prosperous and productive society can be built with this approach?

Re: Evidence from leaked account data on how elites use offshore banking [pdf]

#86

Post by tarsinge »

Swizec wrote: post #51
ajsnigrutin wrote: post #38

That's why i'm against high taxes. We get a bunch of random political parties, promising to "tax the rich" and stuff, we get new laws... and what happens? - The poor already pay very little tax - no change there - The rich avoid the tax by doing shady stuff (who remembers the panama papers.. or this.. or many other stories like these) - I, the middle class engineer get fucked by the taxes, and I get fucked hard, and…

> I, the middle class engineer get fucked by the taxes Fwiw we feel like middle class but we’re really in the top 5% or higher. We’re the rich people these taxes and politicians talk about. The ultra rich/wealthy are a red herring, there’s only a few 10k of them of them. Only 614 people are billionaires. 7 figure income (salary) puts you in top 0.35% ... that’s 1,120,000 Americans. Not a whole lot. edit: top 10% star…

> The ultra rich/wealthy are a red herring, there’s only a few 10k of them of them. Only 614 people are billionaires.

Have a look at what inconveniencing just 400 of them would do (they would still be billionaire after) https://mkorostoff.github.io/1-pixel-wealth/

Re: Evidence from leaked account data on how elites use offshore banking [pdf]

#87

Post by alasdair_ »

ficklepickle wrote: post #33
wait_a_minute wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What do you recommend for people who want to increase their wealth but aren't rich yet? The people who have potential and a solid foundation but don't yet have the capital necessary to move around like that and find the most favorable place.

> aren't rich yet This is the real reason the ultra-wealthy aren't taxed. People think that they are obviously going to become rich any day now, and they won't want to pay high taxes when it inevitability happens. Some strange, shared delusion of the middle class.

>the ultra-wealthy aren't taxed.

The ultra-wealthy pay more tax per capita than any other group. This is the opposite of "aren't taxed"

Re: Evidence from leaked account data on how elites use offshore banking [pdf]

#88

Post by Guest42 »

trentnix wrote: post #64
ajsnigrutin wrote: post #38

That's why i'm against high taxes. We get a bunch of random political parties, promising to "tax the rich" and stuff, we get new laws... and what happens? - The poor already pay very little tax - no change there - The rich avoid the tax by doing shady stuff (who remembers the panama papers.. or this.. or many other stories like these) - I, the middle class engineer get fucked by the taxes, and I get fucked hard, and…

And the taxes they take from you get spent as poorly as possible. And the solution is always more taxes.

My impression is that GWB and DJT delivered some very large tax breaks and that the “more” taxes would be more accurately described as a return to normal taxation levels, provided how much one agrees that post-Reagan establishes the level of normalcy.

I do agree though that the spending could be improved. That position varies group by group.

Re: Evidence from leaked account data on how elites use offshore banking [pdf]

#89

Post by ClumsyPilot »

Swizec wrote: post #51
ajsnigrutin wrote: post #38

That's why i'm against high taxes. We get a bunch of random political parties, promising to "tax the rich" and stuff, we get new laws... and what happens? - The poor already pay very little tax - no change there - The rich avoid the tax by doing shady stuff (who remembers the panama papers.. or this.. or many other stories like these) - I, the middle class engineer get fucked by the taxes, and I get fucked hard, and…

> I, the middle class engineer get fucked by the taxes Fwiw we feel like middle class but we’re really in the top 5% or higher. We’re the rich people these taxes and politicians talk about. The ultra rich/wealthy are a red herring, there’s only a few 10k of them of them. Only 614 people are billionaires. 7 figure income (salary) puts you in top 0.35% ... that’s 1,120,000 Americans. Not a whole lot. edit: top 10% star…

"there’s only a few 10k of them of them."

And they own half the country.

Re: Evidence from leaked account data on how elites use offshore banking [pdf]

#90

Post by modo_mario »

fighterpilot wrote: post #77
DSingularity wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Come on. The ultra-rich don’t pay their fair share. You know this and everyone knows this. Wealth inequality is obscene. Full stop.

The top 1% pay 6x more tax than the bottom 50%! It's obscene how much they pay and how a small group of individuals is forced to carry the entire country. Much, much more should be expected from the bottom 50%.

>The top 1% pay 6x more tax than the bottom 50%!

And yet their share of wealth keeps on growing and growing for decades. Curious.

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