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Parler partially reappears with support from Russian technology firm

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Re: Parler partially reappears with support from Russian technology firm

#81

Post by asplake »

mjevans wrote: post #29

Democracy works best when critical thinking skills and public disclosure of information co-operate. Better understanding why people believe in the conspiracy theories and fixing the social ills that radicalize portions of the population will be critical factors during my entire adult lifetime. For the US, and for the world at large. We need to learn how to prevent terrorists from being created and in so doing advance…

Nice thought, but whose critical thinking skills? Unrealistic to think that more than a tiny minority of people would choose that over gut reaction. The latter is human instinct at work, and the former takes energy (see Kahnemann).

Re: Parler partially reappears with support from Russian technology firm

#82

Post by neartheplain »

AWildC182 wrote: post #42
heshiebee wrote: post #34

I’m not sure where all this hate on parler is coming from. While Twitter allowed the trending of #AssassinateTrump and #killtrump plus all the violence and destruction orchestrated on Twitter during the BLM protests on hundreds of small businesses in America where far more damage and fatalities occurred then the capital riots and big tech especially Apple, Amazon and Facebook were quite about. This is a collaboration…

> far more damage and fatalities Name the fatalities from BLM activities.

Partial list:

David Dorn [0], Lorenzo Anderson [1], Antonio Mays Jr. [2], Barry Perkins [3], Chris Beaty [4], Marquis M. Tousant [5], Oscar Lee Stewart Jr. [6], Jessica Doty Whitaker [7], Italia Marie Kelly [8].

Regular shootings and killings also spiked this summer in cities with significant BLM activity [9][10][11]. In the midst of protests and looting in Chicago, that city saw 18 murders within a 24-hour period, its deadliest single day in six decades [12].

These figures exclude excess “deaths of despair” such as from suicide, alcoholism and drug overdose that may result from the $2 billion in economic damage done mostly to private businesses [13].

[0] https://www.kiro7.com/news/trending/retired-police-captain-k...

[1] https://www.seattletimes.com/seattle-news/teen-who-died-in-c...

[2] https://www.seattletimes.com/seattle-news/everybody-down-wha...

[3] https://www.ksdk.com/article/news/local/protester-run-over-k...

[4] https://www.indystar.com/story/news/local/indianapolis/2020/...

[5] https://www.desmoinesregister.com/story/news/crime-and-court...

[6] https://www.clarionledger.com/story/news/2020/10/21/authorit...

[7] https://www.foxnews.com/us/indiana-woman-shot-killed-argumen...

[8] https://apnews.com/article/18e8ec5a9b8e7175a128254d55df41e3

[9] https://www.oregonlive.com/crime/2020/07/portland-sees-spike...

[10] https://www.wsbtv.com/news/2-investigates/atlanta-police-act...

[11] https://www.washingtonpost.com/national/minneapolis-police-s...

[12] https://chicago.suntimes.com/crime/2020/6/8/21281998/chicago...

[13] https://fee.org/articles/george-floyd-riots-caused-record-se...

Re: Parler partially reappears with support from Russian technology firm

#83

Post by 29083011397778 »

mjevans wrote: post #64
AWildC182 wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is an interesting take that I'd like to dig into a little more... Do you mind expanding on if there are any known ways to achieve this?

That isn't my area of expertise, but I recognize that I would like those who are experts to examine the situation and make such proposals. I did mention one basic thing that I think would help. Better critical thinking education. Help people understand common logical fallacies. Help people consider critically that others might be lying out of self benefit and to focus added skepticism against any claims that might al…

There's a CBC article at the top of hackernews right now, headlined "Nearly half of adult Canadians struggle with literacy" [0]

The article makes a point of stating that most Canadians leave school with those skills, but they atrophy over time until Canadians either need to re-learn them for a career change, or lose them entirely.

I'm unconvinced focusing more on reading comperhension and considering sources in school is any sort of fix here, considering those are skills we leave school with. It won't help, IMO, when 49% of Candian adults cannot disregard irrelevant information to complete a task (as referenced in the article). These are skills that won't be practiced, and therefore will be lost.

[0] https://www.cbc.ca/radio/costofliving/let-s-get-digital-from...

Re: Parler partially reappears with support from Russian technology firm

#84

Post by neartheplain »

CathedralBorrow wrote: post #74

Regardless of hosting, Parler seems to be dead in the water given how much of the Internet is accessed via mobile devices, and Parler being banned from all (both) major app stores.

Web apps still exist, and can be installed to the Android/iOS home screen. Sites like Gab which are banned from major app stores are designed to be used this way.

When I use Twitter or Facebook, I do so exclusively via Chrome on mobile. I want to give adtech companies as few native hooks as possible into my smartphone.

Re: Parler partially reappears with support from Russian technology firm

#85

Post by [deleted] »

AnthonyMouse wrote: post #70
mjevans wrote: post #29

Democracy works best when critical thinking skills and public disclosure of information co-operate. Better understanding why people believe in the conspiracy theories and fixing the social ills that radicalize portions of the population will be critical factors during my entire adult lifetime. For the US, and for the world at large. We need to learn how to prevent terrorists from being created and in so doing advance…

We already know the answer to a lot of this. Algorithms that increase "engagement" by promoting controversy promote conspiracy theories, because conspiracy theories are controversial and get everybody arguing. The first generation of response to this was to tweak the algorithm to favor "trusted" sources, but still promote controversy. This seems to be going extremely poorly, because it's encouraging the "trusted" sou…

[deleted]

Re: Parler partially reappears with support from Russian technology firm

#86

Post by dc2k08 »

vkou wrote: post #79
dc2k08 wrote: post #76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Twitter and facebook both enabled the spreading of a fake news conspiracy in 2020 that the death of drug-addled criminal during the course of a difficult arrest in which a multiethnic police crew applied the protocol that had been signed off on by a black police chief was the result of anti-black racism. Consequently sections of cities were burned, stores were looted, people were attacked and killed. These riots, we…

There have been thousands of BLM protests, with millions of people participating them across the entire year. The overwhelming majority of them have been peaceful. The overwhelming majority of the violence inflicted during them has been done by... Police forces. Most of it was done against people legally protesting, not against looters, trespassers or vandals. Meanwhile, one 'stop the steal' capitol insurrection resu…

Twitter didn't ban a former prime minister of Malaysia for stating "Muslims have the right to be angry and kill millions of French people for the massacres of the past" in the wake of a school teacher being beheaded by a Muslim parent, angered that pupils were being taught freedom of speech includes freedom to offend.

Re: Parler partially reappears with support from Russian technology firm

#87

Post by stareatgoats »

rebuilder wrote: post #77
hyko wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well the first order of business in protecting democracy is to crush the terrorists head on. Doesn’t really matter what their back story is. You must confront the terrorist first, and win. You’re not going to win the long game by losing the short one.

I was going to say the exact opposite. Well, almost. You do need some action against the most radicalised, violent elements. Goal #1 of a radical organisation: create a division. Your narrative is that you represent a downtrodden demographic - "us" - whose misfortune is caused by those in power - "them". Goal #2: invite hatred and repression The worst thing that can happen for you is for your division to dissolve. Yo…

Agree with most of your analysis, including the absolute need to isolate and pacify the core of the extremists so that they are not able to 'infect' the masses through polarization. Just to add a few more things to the 'todo'-list:

4. Keep a check on those elements on 'our' side that are dependent on conflict with some 'other'. If the last decades have taught us anything I think it is that a polarized environment is forced on us by an alliance of extremists on both sides that thrive on conflict. People who don't shy away from provocations, false flag operations or falsified intelligence to achieve their antagonistic goals.

5. Remove as many incentives as possible for petty criminals to be recruited by terrorists. Make sure every citizen have a place and belong in society. Let's not make terrorist actions a shortcut to herostratic fame [0]

6. Actively research and promote alternatives to a revenge mentality in society. Revenge appeals to us because it is a reptilian brain response to harm on a personal basis. It is useless as a response to terrorist strategists (it just makes us their puppets).

[0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Herostratus

Re: Parler partially reappears with support from Russian technology firm

#88

Post by dc2k08 »

alphabettsy wrote: post #78
dc2k08 wrote: post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Twitter and facebook tolerate the use of their apps to set up autonomous zones within american cities and incite users to riot, loot, commit arson and murder cops so why doesn't parler just use a similar hosting infrastructure to whatever they use?

I’ll pretend this is an argument in good faith and point out the explicit intent in the messages to commit crimes is the point. Organization of a protest that draws 100,000 where a small number commit crimes is much different than rallying 100,000 with the stated purpose of committing crimes.

Widespread vandalism and looting during BLM protests cost the insurance industry and estimated $2 BILLION. Hardly small potatoes.

Seeing as organising the set up of autonomous states within American cities is allowed on twitter on facebook, the tiny number of Trump supporters who entered the capitol and could just say they wanted to set up an an autonomous state there.

Re: Parler partially reappears with support from Russian technology firm

#89

Post by hyko »

rebuilder wrote: post #77
hyko wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well the first order of business in protecting democracy is to crush the terrorists head on. Doesn’t really matter what their back story is. You must confront the terrorist first, and win. You’re not going to win the long game by losing the short one.

I was going to say the exact opposite. Well, almost. You do need some action against the most radicalised, violent elements. Goal #1 of a radical organisation: create a division. Your narrative is that you represent a downtrodden demographic - "us" - whose misfortune is caused by those in power - "them". Goal #2: invite hatred and repression The worst thing that can happen for you is for your division to dissolve. Yo…

I agree that we should work to undermine the forces of radicalisation; outreach and social justice efforts may bear fruit in decades or centuries. Democracy is at stake today.

We must acknowledge that all the rights and privileges we enjoy in a democracy exist because they are backed up with recourse to an organisation that can defeat anyone else physically. There can be no leniency when someone threatens the government itself with physical violence; it must respond to the threat totally and severely, or else it will cease to be the government. Perhaps that plays into the hands of someone trying to divide the populace; it doesn’t really matter. This is what an existential threat looks like.

If the government does not enforce its monopoly of violence, every week you will be fighting gun battles outside your courts and legislative assemblies, just like those other failed states we’ve all read about.

Re: Parler partially reappears with support from Russian technology firm

#90

Post by CathedralBorrow »

neartheplain wrote: post #84
CathedralBorrow wrote: post #74

Regardless of hosting, Parler seems to be dead in the water given how much of the Internet is accessed via mobile devices, and Parler being banned from all (both) major app stores.

Web apps still exist, and can be installed to the Android/iOS home screen. Sites like Gab which are banned from major app stores are designed to be used this way. When I use Twitter or Facebook, I do so exclusively via Chrome on mobile. I want to give adtech companies as few native hooks as possible into my smartphone.

They definitely exist, and can be installed to home screens.

It is however a huge hurdle to user acquisition, which is the angle I was referring to. The obscurity of Gab kind of supports that point. All kinds of products and services can exist, but if you get booted of all the main channels you are doomed to be an obscure niche at best.

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