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GnuCOBOL 3.1.1

sourceforge.net

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Re: GnuCOBOL 3.1.1

#81

Post by simias »

rhabarba wrote: post #28
simias wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Whose hatred? I don't think I've seen anybody really hate on COBOL, it's just mostly irrelevant for modern programmers and people like to mock the FULL CAPS ULTRA VERBOSE SYNTAX (something that COBOL programmers themselves routinely do, see ADD 1 TO COBOL GIVING COBOL).

I disagree with your definition of modern programmers. I mean, we still emulate VT100 terminals on our 2020 MacBooks (poorly), so the implication that everything old must be renewed is - in theory - good, but COBOL is probably not the first thing that comes to my mind here... Modern COBOL does not enforce CAPS LOCK anymore though - and you can even skip the 7-columns indentation if you wish!

To be clear I wasn't making a judgement of value, I was just stating matter-of-factly that I've been a professional dev for over 15 years and while I did occasionally encounter some more niche languages I haven't actually bumped into a COBOL listing if I wasn't specifically looking for it. Fortran, Scheme, Haskell, Erlang, Modula? Occasionally. COBOL, never.

Re: GnuCOBOL 3.1.1

#82

Post by 0x445442 »

nix23 wrote: post #22
speeder wrote: post #5

Sometimes I wonder if I should learn COBOL just so maybe I can get my first real programming job. (and no, I am not joking...)

I say YES do it, learn COBOL and Mainframes, don't listen to others who say Mainframe is a thing of the past, it's here to stay. Just talk with leading positions in Insurance/Finance government maybe?, they are more then happy to find someone who is motivated and eager to learn, AND they have the money and time to support and build-you-up (Training mentors certs licenses etc.).

I would say from a career path perspective this world seems to offer some advantages in the area of cumulative knowledge acquisition. Whereas the typical career path in The Enterprise one is faced with technology churn every few years.

Being in The Enterprise, I find it quite frustrating dealing with the new shiny every few years when there's rarely objective analysis behind being made to do so.

Re: GnuCOBOL 3.1.1

#83

Post by bsg75 »

bildung wrote: post #41
michaelcampbell wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I suspect they are more suspicious of `pandas` than the syntax of the import. But, I'm also curious as to why.

Probably because it is indicative of a script written by a scientist, ignoring software engineering principles.

Because of Pandas specific issues, or the concept of data frames in general, which are also prevalent in R and Scala?

Re: GnuCOBOL 3.1.1

#84

Post by necheffa »

hansor wrote: post #62

Its awful that most people here are criticizing COBOL, yet they don't even know it, but they just "heard bad things about it". In my country and in Sweden it is quite easy to get good and stable job in banking/insurance/consulting business with Cobol on Z/OS. Salary is around 10-30k PER MONTH. Around 3x more then in let's say Java.

I was forced to take a COBAL & z/OS course during college. And I was pretty good at it. Local bank wanted to make sure it had a steady supply of COBAL programmers.

I hate COBAL a lot, and incidentally for many of the same reasons I hate Java.

Re: GnuCOBOL 3.1.1

#86

Post by generalk »

speeder wrote: post #37
Minor49er wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Just curious, but why is COBOL the first language that you think about for this?

Because I already know: C, C++, Obj-C, C#, Php, Lua, x86 ASM, ARM ASM, Linoleum (some ASM-like esoteric languagE), BASIC (not VB), Java, Python, JS, MushCODE (it is derived from LISP), SQL and some application specific scripting languages. I started coding when I was 8, I am 32 now, and in my government-issued employer list, I had zero employers. My dad knows COBOL and MUMPS, and kept talking about how horrible they…

Getting a job or building a career in software development isn't about the languages you know. Your list is pretty broad and COBOL probably won't help.

It's what value you can provide with those that counts.

One of my earlier companies started with a policy against hiring folks who just knew PHP, even though that was our main language. We wanted folks who knew SQL, some JS, maybe some C or something to prove they were well-rounded and could think about tech as a whole.

We dropped that policy when folks started coming in with _just_ Ruby on Rails under their belt. They were destroying our project-based interview and blasting out projects in weeks that typically took us months. And we found that we could easily teach them the SQL they needed when they needed it.

I'm not saying it's _just that easy_ but if a dev hits my interview process and shows they can understand my customer's needs and build out a solution to those needs quickly, I _very much_ want to give them a job.

Re: GnuCOBOL 3.1.1

#87

Post by Misteur-Z »

hansor wrote: post #62

Its awful that most people here are criticizing COBOL, yet they don't even know it, but they just "heard bad things about it". In my country and in Sweden it is quite easy to get good and stable job in banking/insurance/consulting business with Cobol on Z/OS. Salary is around 10-30k PER MONTH. Around 3x more then in let's say Java.

Until some COBOL developer publishes his pay slip, I will stick to reality, top IT salaries are at tech giants.

From personal experience: BNP Paribas is one of the biggest bank in the world, top 5 if you exclude Chinese state owned ones, and they pay mainframe related jobs like shit.

Being young, smart and with a whole career ahead, you have no future working has a COBOL developer, no one should spend his life picking up shitty code left by his elders decades ago.

Re: GnuCOBOL 3.1.1

#88

Post by the_only_law »

simias wrote: post #81
rhabarba wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I disagree with your definition of modern programmers. I mean, we still emulate VT100 terminals on our 2020 MacBooks (poorly), so the implication that everything old must be renewed is - in theory - good, but COBOL is probably not the first thing that comes to my mind here... Modern COBOL does not enforce CAPS LOCK anymore though - and you can even skip the 7-columns indentation if you wish!

To be clear I wasn't making a judgement of value, I was just stating matter-of-factly that I've been a professional dev for over 15 years and while I did occasionally encounter some more niche languages I haven't actually bumped into a COBOL listing if I wasn't specifically looking for it. Fortran, Scheme, Haskell, Erlang, Modula? Occasionally. COBOL, never.

> Modula

Ok now I’m curious...

Re: GnuCOBOL 3.1.1

#89

Post by shrubble »

On the one hand we love and respect Admiral Grace Hopper and on the other hand the COBOL language she is credited with is scorned. I always thought this was somewhat unusual.
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