Split Keyboard for Professionals • Hacker News Board

Re: Split Keyboard for Professionals

#81

Post by wegs » Mon, Sep 28, 2020, 2:35 PM UTC

simias wrote: post #35

wegs wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Most are horrible. One of the reasons is overlap. Your hands do occasionally hit keys on the other side. You want a pair of 2/3 keyboards, rather than 1/2 keyboards. You /especially/ want a lot of the "special" keys on both sides. Another is key action. You want proper mechanical keys. A third is mounting. That's a problem which hasn't really been figured out. The middle hinge or fixed setup is definitely sub-ideal.…

>One of the reasons is overlap. Your hands do occasionally hit keys on the other side. When I switched to a split keyboard I did have this problem at first (with the B and 6 keys in particular on a QWERTY layout) but it took me a week to relearn that. In particular if you use an ortholinear layout on each side there's really no reason to go fishing for keys with the wrong hand. This in turn means that you can add new…

My goalposts are "a keyboard which works for me." That's where they were, and that's where they will be.

If I give up a few things I like about my existing keyboard to get what you like about your keyboard, that's a bad deal. I think that's true for most people.

The type of mechanical keys on my keyboards really reduce the amount of strain on my wrist relative to membrane keyboards. It's not just a matter of taste. There's much less of a bump on the bottom if the key can continue moving after the keystroke is triggered. Membrane keyboards can do a little bit of that, but not nearly as well.

Trackpoint, implemented well, means I can do casual mousing (e.g. switching focus) without moving my hands to the mouse. That reduces shoulder strain.

You're welcome to call things I like "a bad idea," and I could do the reverse just as well, but at the end of the day, I ain't buying. I know what works for me, and I haven't found an "ergo" keyboard which does.

Re: Split Keyboard for Professionals

#82

Post by codazoda » Mon, Sep 28, 2020, 2:38 PM UTC

tharne wrote: post #77

I started using a dactyl manuform about two months ago and now I can't imagine typo on anything else. I'm already planning on order a second one for the office, assuming we ever return to it.

These keyboards look interesting but how does "space" work on it and how long did it take you to learn the non-qwerty parts of the layout (like space, hyphen, brackets, and tilde)?

Re: Split Keyboard for Professionals

#83

Post by 1-more » Mon, Sep 28, 2020, 2:38 PM UTC

stavros wrote: post #29

cliffwarden wrote: post #17

I just picked up a moonlander that i'm really living. https://www.zsa.io/moonlander/

I wouldn't recommend an ortho keyboard, I've found it takes a lot of time to relearn how to type with not much benefit.

For me it was honestly a day or two. N=1 I know, but it's not too tough.

Re: Split Keyboard for Professionals

#84

Post by Symbiote » Mon, Sep 28, 2020, 2:39 PM UTC

I'm maintaining a gallery of split mechanical keyboards, including the Ultimate Hacking Keyboard.

Hopefully it's helpful for a quick overview of the options that exist. Many of these keyboards are DIY (available as a kit, or sometimes just a PCB and case plan), but some are available assembled.

https://aposymbiont.github.io/split-keyboards/

(There's also https://jhelvy.shinyapps.io/splitkbcompare/ for direct comparison of ergonomic (with thumb keys) keyboards.)

Re: Split Keyboard for Professionals

#85

Post by philote » Mon, Sep 28, 2020, 2:41 PM UTC

buzzy_hacker wrote: post #72

stavros wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wouldn't recommend an ortho keyboard, I've found it takes a lot of time to relearn how to type with not much benefit.

I think it’s more individualistic. I switched to ortho (Kinesis Advantage), and it only took a couple days to get back to my prior typing speed.

Agreed, it didn't take long for me to learn to use the Advantage. But before that I had tried it a few times and got frustrated that I wasn't immediately able to use it. I'm glad I finally took the time though, because I love this keyboard.

Re: Split Keyboard for Professionals

#86

Post by burntcookie90 » Mon, Sep 28, 2020, 2:41 PM UTC

jjkaczor wrote: post #79

Myself, I have been using a Kinesis RGB Edge with the "lift-kit" for about a month. Have never been a perfect, trained touch-typist - so there has been a learning curve, but it is worth it. My wrists feel so much better, and I am almost back to full speed. (Previously, I would just use laptop KB's). The only complaints... Not from me, but when I am on web meetings, I have to be on mute, because everyone finds the KB…

Same! and my wpm actually went up almost 30%

Re: Split Keyboard for Professionals

#87

Post by chansiky » Mon, Sep 28, 2020, 2:41 PM UTC

bbojan wrote: post #56

chansiky wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I almost always use a split keyboard when I'm able to set up a stationary environment. But I love to go mobile: coffee shops, beaches, couch, bar counters. I never forget how to use a normal keyboard, nor do I lose any speed. That might be the trick, maybe you need to switch between the two occasionally.

I have this crazy plan to create a harness where the two keyboard halves hang on the sides of your body (think sitting or standing with your arms naturally hanging down - the keyboards will be positioned under your palms). But I'm still not sure if it would be too cyborg-y enough to use in public...

HAHA! Could be just sewn into your pants. Then you could just walk around the hood wearing some AR goggles while you work. Doesn't solve the tendency for your arms to swing in the opposite direction of you legs though.

Re: Split Keyboard for Professionals

#88

Post by jjkaczor » Mon, Sep 28, 2020, 2:41 PM UTC

jjkaczor wrote: post #79

Myself, I have been using a Kinesis RGB Edge with the "lift-kit" for about a month. Have never been a perfect, trained touch-typist - so there has been a learning curve, but it is worth it. My wrists feel so much better, and I am almost back to full speed. (Previously, I would just use laptop KB's). The only complaints... Not from me, but when I am on web meetings, I have to be on mute, because everyone finds the KB…

(and the Kinesis KB noise can be mitigated by the choice of switches, I went with "cherry mx brown", but you can choose a quieter option)

Re: Split Keyboard for Professionals

#89

Post by MrPowers » Mon, Sep 28, 2020, 2:43 PM UTC

StavrosK wrote: post #66

MrPowers wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've loved learning how to use ortho keyboards. They open your brain to new text editing possibilities. Just like how learning Spanish teaches you about English and learning new programming languages teaches you about what's possible with code. They improved my typing accuracy and got rid of my right pinky pain too. I agree that they're not for everyone.

Hmm, really? What did they open your brain to? I didn't see any benefit, it's just harder.

Emacs keybindings like Control-x Control-c don't work for me on regular keyboards. They work just fine for me on ortho keyboards with an easily accessible control key for my right thumb.

Ortho keyboards got me in the habit on using modifier keys on the opposite side of the keyboard from the shortcut key. On a regular keyboard, I'll type Command + c with my left thumb / left index finger with an unergonmic movement. On an ortho keyboard, I use my right thumb + left middle finger for the same motion.

For Vim, I started using Control + c to escape with ortho keyboards, which keeps me on the home row.

None of these are huge productivity gains. But a fun way to shock your brain and to stay sharp.

Re: Split Keyboard for Professionals

#90

Post by eee_honda » Mon, Sep 28, 2020, 2:43 PM UTC

jjkaczor wrote: post #79

Myself, I have been using a Kinesis RGB Edge with the "lift-kit" for about a month. Have never been a perfect, trained touch-typist - so there has been a learning curve, but it is worth it. My wrists feel so much better, and I am almost back to full speed. (Previously, I would just use laptop KB's). The only complaints... Not from me, but when I am on web meetings, I have to be on mute, because everyone finds the KB…

I had a kinesis before they did the cool new upgrades with cherry switches and whatnot. I will probably buy one of those, now.

What's particularly great about them is that you can set them up vertically so that your wrists are completely neutral. Same concept as a vertical mouse, and similarly restrictive in its functioning.

Most people probably don't need this level of relief. Idk.