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I just lost 1,400 BTC

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Re: I just lost 1,400 BTC

#81
post #38

Why would someone holding 1400 BTC use a software wallet instead of an offline hardware wallet? SMH

Even a single hardware wallet would have been risky - loss or damage, or theft. For high values, set up multi signature hardware wallets, at least a 2 of 3 scheme, each stored in different geographic locations.

Re: I just lost 1,400 BTC

#82
post #66

I can't believe someone would even allow a system with that balance to even connect to the internet. It's like filling a car with gold bars, driving it around town, and hoping nothing bad happens. He could have created another wallet, preferably a multisig, created the transaction with the software wallet offline, copied the signed transaction off and broadcast it from another system. What he did was reckless. Some p…

Bitcoin is all online. The analogy doesn't work: your gold bars are being driven around town all day and night in public view, already. In this case, it's just the fact that the access was granted at the application level when the user logged into their wallet, which is like giving someone keys to your car by mistake.

No. One can store keys offline. That's what hardware wallets do.

Re: I just lost 1,400 BTC

#83
post #77
post #38

Why would someone holding 1400 BTC use a software wallet instead of an offline hardware wallet? SMH

Yeah this is what blows my mind. I would be paranoid if I had 14 BTC, let alone 1400. When I had (as much as) 19 BTC some while ago I stored them on a Trezor, with the seed on a paper (three copies in different places) in a form that no one would realize it actually was a seed.

Be careful... sometimes we end up making things so complicated that we forget how it works. Think why comments are so crucial after looking at your own code from a year ago and having no clue what you meant. :-)

Re: I just lost 1,400 BTC

#84
post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I completely disagree, only the first $250k is insured. I would never store $16M cash in a bank. You aren't protected against the bank becoming insolvent.

Okay... where would you store 16m?

Some in stocks, some in banks, some in bonds, some in real estate, some in precious metals, etc.

Re: I just lost 1,400 BTC

#85
post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Bitcoin is all online. The analogy doesn't work: your gold bars are being driven around town all day and night in public view, already. In this case, it's just the fact that the access was granted at the application level when the user logged into their wallet, which is like giving someone keys to your car by mistake.

No. One can store keys offline. That's what hardware wallets do.

In order to do anything with Bitcoin, which appears to be what the author wanted, you would have to be connected to the Internet. Keys being stored in hardware wallet sure, but the gold bars are still in public view.

Hardware wallets aren't without their flaws. With an application-level vulneravility in a hardware wallet, you are still screwed. Here is just one example: https://www.ledger.com/improving-the-ecosystem-disclosure-of...

Re: I just lost 1,400 BTC

#86
post #81
post #38

Why would someone holding 1400 BTC use a software wallet instead of an offline hardware wallet? SMH

Even a single hardware wallet would have been risky - loss or damage, or theft. For high values, set up multi signature hardware wallets, at least a 2 of 3 scheme, each stored in different geographic locations.

That's overly complicated. A single hardware wallet in a fire proof safe or a safe deposit box in a bank vault is sufficient for this use case. If a hardware wallet were stolen, the thief would still have to guess the password. q.v. https://xkcd.com/538

Re: I just lost 1,400 BTC

#87
post #3

With big money comes big responsibility. Storing $16M should be taken very seriously and probably most people have no clue about that.

I think the point is that you can store $16M in a bank and take need to take no precautions against casual theft (and often can recover the money via person-to-person interactions, if theft does occur).

I keep hearing that, and yet see mailbox hacks where the attacker tells accounts payable to update the payee's account and the money goes bye bye. Seems to turn into an insurance matter. I'm not sure why, but apparently just getting the bank to get the money back isn't so simple. Nobody talks about it in public. Haven't personally seen 8 figure amounts, but have seen amounts around a million dollars.

Re: I just lost 1,400 BTC

#88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sizable, like 2%?

I looked it up. 6% of Americans don’t have a bank account. Doesn’t say whether they could go ahead and get one, or they choose not to. Sizable?

Correct me please if I'm wrong, but I'd say most of those folks not served by a bank wouldn't have the skills to manage bitcoins either.

Re: I just lost 1,400 BTC

#89
post #60
post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The whole point of cryptocurrency on is that they don't believe in ANY of those institutions.

Maybe in the beginning, it looks like gold rush now.

I still keep reading about the cryptocoin utopia fantasy. Where Bitcoin somehow starts being used as currency for some reason.

I keep reading about how bad fiat currency is, and how it's backed by nothing (except, you know, literally superpowers who have nukes).

But yes, there are tulip speculators too.

Re: I just lost 1,400 BTC

#90
post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In an investment account with a reputable brokerage.

What's the difference between that and a bank?

Well the fun part is that the way it's different is that there would be a bank account with your money in it, that the brokerage isn't allowed to touch. So, you're protected from the brokerage going bankrupt - your money is still yours if that happens.

But it's still in a bank account, so if the bank goes under you're screwed. See my other comment in this thread though...

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