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TikTok and Microsoft’s Clock

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Re: TikTok and Microsoft’s Clock

#81

Post by thebean11 »

whoevercares wrote: post #75
patall wrote: post #70

Beside all the political issues, what is Microsoft actually supposedly buying here? The data centre, data and access to it? Because it does not seem to me that they are buying any of the developers, am I right? At least there is no talk about that. How well can you run a platform by buying its software without any of the people that run it, at least from my developer point of view that seems a very strange idea. Basi…

How did you know they won’t acquire the talents? Is it because... those people might be Chinese engineers?

So the Chinese side of the company wouldn't have any engineers..? Or they'd split them? I think you missed the point.

Re: TikTok and Microsoft’s Clock

#82

Post by sandworm101 »

andreilys wrote: post #79
Hokusai wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Suppose Margrethe Vestager called and said TikTok, you are banned unless you let a "very european" company Wouldn't do this make sense for Facebook? I would like to see a European company owning the European side of Facebook. I really like Silicon Valley and their initiative, but again and again American companies have shown that they cannot be trusted with European data (maybe USA data either, but that is an inter…

I really like Silicon Valley and their initiative, but again and again American companies have shown that they cannot be trusted with European data Source? Btw HSBC [1], Unilever [2] and many other European companies have had customer data breaches. I’m sure there would be even more but Europe has almost no top internet consumer companies So I don’t have a lot of trust in European companies to safeguard customer data…

>>American companies have shown that they cannot be trusted with European data. Source?

Room 641A? NSLs? Lotus Notes? The RSA fiasco? The EU report on Project ECHELON? The PSP? CNN? PBS Frontline? Edward Snowden? ... all the security news for the last few decades.

I might not agree with the idea that US companies are totally untrustworthy, but I would never suggest that idea is unfounded.

Re: TikTok and Microsoft’s Clock

#83

Post by marketingtech »

Hokusai wrote: post #30
chvid wrote: post #3

Where is EU in this embarrassment? Suppose Margrethe Vestager called and said TikTok, you are banned unless you let a "very european" company take over your business? And by the way. We would like a cut. And would the US still being able to say "national security" if it was fully owned by German business running on servers in some Swiss mountain?

> Suppose Margrethe Vestager called and said TikTok, you are banned unless you let a "very european" company Wouldn't do this make sense for Facebook? I would like to see a European company owning the European side of Facebook. I really like Silicon Valley and their initiative, but again and again American companies have shown that they cannot be trusted with European data (maybe USA data either, but that is an inter…

On paper and for regulatory/tax purposes, a European company does own the European side of Facebook - Facebook Ireland Ltd.

Re: TikTok and Microsoft’s Clock

#84

Post by SpicyLemonZest »

thebean11 wrote: post #81
whoevercares wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How did you know they won’t acquire the talents? Is it because... those people might be Chinese engineers?

So the Chinese side of the company wouldn't have any engineers..? Or they'd split them? I think you missed the point.

TikTok is a subsidiary with mostly non-Chinese employees, so unless there's more information available, I'd assume the acquisition deal involves Microsoft hiring them. The Chinese side of the business is entirely under the parent company ByteDance that Microsoft is buying from.

Re: TikTok and Microsoft’s Clock

#85

Post by thebean11 »

someperson wrote: post #77
hellomyguys wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Honestly hard to tell if this is satire. TikTok is way more compelling than Vine was, even at its peak. The idea that Microsoft not buying a dying Vine from Twitter is indicative of its poor leadership is hard to wrap my head around.

People are talking about Microsoft paying more than $30 billion for TikTok's operations in just four countries. Vine was losing Twitter 10 million dollars a month at a time when Twitter was desperate for cash. Microsoft (or Google, or Facebook, or any similar cash rich company) could have bought Vine for tens of millions. The product and algorithm could have been tweaked to be more compelling. Even if the new owner w…

Easy to say in hindsight. At the time it wasn't so obvious that the problem with vine was algorithmic. They wouldn't have known which direction to tweak in; I don't even think Vine had much of an algorithm. It was mostly news feed no?

Re: TikTok and Microsoft’s Clock

#86

Post by ir77 »

FooBarWidget wrote: post #76
borg_ wrote: post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Because the Chinese cyber threat is incredibly real. Comment like this lumps tiktok, a privately owned company with the Chinese government with no evidence. It's never about national security but really about US politicians seeing a social network with real reach in the US that for the first time does NOT need to pay to lobby in the US, nor to be responsive to congressional inquiry (as they have been able to do rec…

It's worse than that. The hostilities towards everything China in 2020 are pushing all sorts of Chinese people away, who otherwise would have been supportive of US and liberal values. What baffles me is that nobody knows that this is happening. Nobody is trying to understand how the other side sees it, and to work towards a real solution. Or maybe people are just wilfully blind to this possibility. People are so conv…

anyone with power and wealth in china is dependent on the government, they only have these things because the government allowed them to have and keep it, for now. thus it really doesn't matter how one individual on that side sees things, he sees things the way his side allows him to see.

it would be different if people exiled from china and were getting involving once they're in the western world, but to broadcast one's independence while in china is a moot point.

i have been to china many times and have many chinese friends, also many HK friends, and the chinese, while while very hospitable to the US will never pick US over china, never publicly or to an outsider anyways, they always follow the party line.

until the mentality of the regime allows and tolerates the discent there are no unique feelings on the other side to consider.

Re: TikTok and Microsoft’s Clock

#87

Post by Eridrus »

lovetocode wrote: post #31
chvid wrote: post #3

Where is EU in this embarrassment? Suppose Margrethe Vestager called and said TikTok, you are banned unless you let a "very european" company take over your business? And by the way. We would like a cut. And would the US still being able to say "national security" if it was fully owned by German business running on servers in some Swiss mountain?

Because the Chinese cyber threat is incredibly real. The United States should be playing hard ball. The US TikTok systems are compromised by Chinese spammers already.

The cyber threat from China is very real, but cyber capability is super cheap. A one-off capability is going to run in the low single digit millions. You wouldn't endanger an asset currently worth tens of billions and growing for that.

Re: TikTok and Microsoft’s Clock

#88

Post by treis »

xvector wrote: post #36
dkobia wrote: post #32

The United States loses the moral high ground moving forward and Microsoft gets a blemished gem. The machinations of this deal are unsightly. Just because this is how the game is played in China doesn't mean we have to do it too.

“Nice rapidly-growing foreign service you have there. It would be a shame if we called it a ‘national security risk’ and made you sell it to us for pennies on the dime!”

China has blocked almost every major US internet company. Crying that Tik Tok is being forced into a sale is a bit rich. National Security concerns aside, there's a legitimate argument that the West should be banning every service that comes out of China until they open up their market.

Re: TikTok and Microsoft’s Clock

#89

Post by Drew_ »

hellomyguys wrote: post #62
someperson wrote: post #12

It continues to be damning that the leadership of Microsoft did not buy Vine [1] from Twitter in 2017 for pennies on the dollar before Vine was shutdown. Vine was very popular, and a lot of people were very disappointed when it was shutdown back when Twitter was bleeding a lot cash. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vine_(service)

Honestly hard to tell if this is satire. TikTok is way more compelling than Vine was, even at its peak. The idea that Microsoft not buying a dying Vine from Twitter is indicative of its poor leadership is hard to wrap my head around.

TikTok hasn't always been as big as it is right now obviously. ByteDance acquired TikTok for $1 billion only 3 years ago. TikTok definitely was not as big as peak Vine at that time.

Re: TikTok and Microsoft’s Clock

#90

Post by FooBarWidget »

ir77 wrote: post #86
FooBarWidget wrote: post #76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's worse than that. The hostilities towards everything China in 2020 are pushing all sorts of Chinese people away, who otherwise would have been supportive of US and liberal values. What baffles me is that nobody knows that this is happening. Nobody is trying to understand how the other side sees it, and to work towards a real solution. Or maybe people are just wilfully blind to this possibility. People are so conv…

anyone with power and wealth in china is dependent on the government, they only have these things because the government allowed them to have and keep it, for now. thus it really doesn't matter how one individual on that side sees things, he sees things the way his side allows him to see. it would be different if people exiled from china and were getting involving once they're in the western world, but to broadcast o…

So you're downplaying the number of people who feel that way. You're also saying that their feelings are not genuine, and only forced upon them.

All this does not bode well for world peace.

Be careful of what you're wishing for. A democratic China may not be so different in terms of geopolitics as you would think (or they would be different, just not in the way you expect). Try reading what Kishore Mahbubani — ex-Singapore diplomat and ex-UN Security Council head — has to say.

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