81–90 of 93 posts
The US federal government has an exact, real-time count and location of every single person with a phone in the country due to universal bulk surveillance. Cross-referenced with the subscriber records from wireless, cable, and utility companies, databases from data brokers that are fed by loyalty programs and supermarkets, and every bank or credit card swipe in real-time, they already have 100% of this data in far hi…
Earlier quoted context omitted.
So in theory, I should hold off on answering so someone gets paid to come to my house? Do they have a quota to hit, like if I take my time with them do they get punished?
Or maybe they would prefer to spend their time finding people who are actually hard to enunerate, rather than wasting on someone who is just looking to consume their time.
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> Nothing. Nothing happens. Except for your area getting federally undercounted, which loses representation and tax dollars for you and all your neighbors.
Is there any reason to believe that more people are failing to fill out the census in my area than in other areas? Because if the failure rate is about the same everywhere it probably does make little difference.
This is worth quoting here IMHO: "However, even if you don't get fined for not filling out the census form, there are some good reasons you should do it anyway. Seats in the House of Representatives seats are apportioned by population, with the most populous states receiving the most seats. Federal and state governments rely on census data to budget for social welfare programs that assist the poor, elderly, disabled…
Some of us live where we oppose all of the current elected officials. In that case, it sounds like opting out is the only effective "vote" we can make in a FPTP system
Also the census results are applied for a whole decade during which officials can change and many elections will take place.
The US census was infamously used to assist in rounding up Americans of specific ethnic backgrounds for concentration camps. It would go a long way to easing people’s minds if they had some way to guarantee that this could not happen again. I realize there is value in gathering attributes beyond just “one person”, but storing these attributes in a way that can be connected to addresses seems seriously problematic.
I agree that the data should be treated anonymously and confidentially, with severe punishment to abuses. Would the lack of census data prevented the concentration camps from operating? It may have instead taken longer and required more people, but I would expect that at the time anyone with a Japanese/Chinese look or name to have been detained anyway. Side note: It seems even the 2nd amendment didn’t help citizens r…
What constitutes "abuse"? Differential privacy is hard. Once the data has been collected, simply not being an expert in statistics can be enough to accidentally leak sensitive data. The government is simultaneously the data collector, data user, and prosecutor of abuses, so I'm skeptical that much will come of any such promise. Maybe a letter of apology in 50 years.
> I suspect these days the government has enough information already on its citizens through other means (intelligence agencies etc) than the census, to still target based on race if they wanted to.
Pointing out that ethnic minorities are likely to be screwed anyway in such a situation, even without census data, is not going to ease anyone’s mind.
The US federal government has an exact, real-time count and location of every single person with a phone in the country due to universal bulk surveillance. Cross-referenced with the subscriber records from wireless, cable, and utility companies, databases from data brokers that are fed by loyalty programs and supermarkets, and every bank or credit card swipe in real-time, they already have 100% of this data in far hi…
I have 6 phones. Am I 6 people?
The US census was infamously used to assist in rounding up Americans of specific ethnic backgrounds for concentration camps. It would go a long way to easing people’s minds if they had some way to guarantee that this could not happen again. I realize there is value in gathering attributes beyond just “one person”, but storing these attributes in a way that can be connected to addresses seems seriously problematic.
I agree that the data should be treated anonymously and confidentially, with severe punishment to abuses. Would the lack of census data prevented the concentration camps from operating? It may have instead taken longer and required more people, but I would expect that at the time anyone with a Japanese/Chinese look or name to have been detained anyway. Side note: It seems even the 2nd amendment didn’t help citizens r…
The problem is "anonymous" data is often really easy to de-anonymize, especially when there's so much unique, identifying information there, as there is with the census.
Even if it did somehow manage to remain anonymous, they could still tell that a person with some undesirable characteristics lived at such and such a location. That would be enough to round people up. They don't necessarily have to know your name.
That article is wrong, and the fine is absolutely not $5,000. If that article were correct, then there would be no federal fines under $5,000 anywhere. This is misinformation that the census bureau likes to spread around to scare people. In face, the Sentencing Reform Act of 1984 applies only to criminal cases.
This means that the fine is actually $100.
I went through this rigmarole when I got one of those off-year census forms during the Obama administration, asking about what my family eats, how many toilets we have, etc. I refused to fill it out. A guy showed up at my door. He showed me the brochure that said it was mandatory, and what the potential fine was. The same $5,000 number was quoted. I told him I would not be participating in this program, and that his brochure was lying because this was not a criminal offense. He agreed it was not a criminal matter. And that was that.
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Interesting. Back when I did it, it was piecework. Maybe one to three dollars per household, depending on whether it was a short or long form, and whether you managed to get someone to fill it out. That was around minimum wage, though if you hustled (or pencil-whipped things), you could probably make more. Also, I think I heard that these days you have to produce your draft registration number in order to apply, whic…
> you have to produce your draft registration number in order to apply Not true. What you actually have to do is sign a form declaring that you are or aren't registered with Selective Service, and if not a brief reason why, which is the same information-gathering requirement for most or all federal jobs. You can actually see the full set of paperwork with PDF forms here: https://www.census.gov/about/census-careers/ne…
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The pay is actually pretty decent, and is cost-of-living adjusted. In Portland where I live, for example, it's $18/hour, which is way better than some temp jobs I've had.
So in theory, I should hold off on answering so someone gets paid to come to my house? Do they have a quota to hit, like if I take my time with them do they get punished?