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Developer salary spreadsheet compiled from tweets

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Re: Developer salary spreadsheet compiled from tweets

#81

Post by senordevnyc »

scarface74 wrote: post #76
j7ake wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Thanks for the info, I guess I should read more into it and educate myself.

I really hate meta discussions, but that being said, I’m going to do it anyway. It’s rare on a discussion forum that a thread goes from - righteous indignation - clarifying non insulting reply - reply with a genuine question - reply with a genuine answer. - the original poster admits that they should learn more. I had to commend both of you.

It’s really rare when I’m involved but I’m trying to do better :)

Re: Developer salary spreadsheet compiled from tweets

#82

Post by randallsquared »

dennisgorelik wrote: post #46
senordevnyc wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It’s really not that bad. I just took a job in NYC at Square making $420k my first year (though stock price increase is already pushing that closer to $500k) and my rent is $4300 for a 2 bedroom in a doorman building in manhattan. It’s expensive, but only about 10% of my gross income. Once you include my wife’s income, it’s even less of a big deal (and she makes under six figures). You might consider CA a hellscape f…

> cost-of-living-adjusted salaries for big tech in SF, Seattle, and NYC are higher than anywhere else in the country ... if you do not have children. Consider how much you would have to pay for a modest 2000 square feet house in SF or NYC.

For NYC, there are a smattering of houses under (to pick an arbitrary cutoff) 900K at 2000 square feet: https://streeteasy.com/houses/nyc/status:open%7Cprice:-60000...

Many have mortgage payment estimates under what senordevnyc mentioned paying for rent, now.

Re: Developer salary spreadsheet compiled from tweets

#83

Post by komali2 »

tchaffee wrote: post #8
rvz wrote: post #4

What is this spreadsheet supposed to prove? It sounds like its either a ego-measuring contest of which company has the best salaries + compensation with position in a certain country (Hint: It's still FAAMNG in Silicon Valley) or it is a giant weird flexing spreadsheet to show that devs in developed countries are paid more that those in third-world countries (Even those who work remotely). The compensation in somewhe…

It's useful to see what your peers are earning, especially for your next salary negotiation. And it's pretty obvious that if you don't live in SF, you shouldn't expect SF salaries.

This was always strange for me, and is a regular drunken debate between my roommates and I.

If a company operates in a global market, why should it pay dramatically different salaries in different cities? For example, our London engineers make like 70k to our 140. But we both work on the same product. We both make the company the same amount of money.

I've always thought it was just another bit of bullshit capitalist policy by companies. Another way to save a dime. My roommates argue about lower cost of living etc.

The ONLY argument I've been at all convinced by is if one imagies a co-op of several individual contributors that happen to be distributed. All provide equal value. Some live in Hanoi, some in San Francisco. They have a limited pool of income to distribute, and they decide they want to do so based on the metric of Comfort Of Living, which thus results in Hanoi employee taking home less so their SF colleagues can have an comfort of living.

But the clincher there is the extremely limited static income. That's the excuse I think companies make, but any time I've seen the financials, I've seen plenty of room to pay everyone fairly. If the company can't afford to give everyone SF salaries, then how can you justify hiring any SF engineers?

It smacks of classism, it smacks of corporate plutocracy.

Re: Developer salary spreadsheet compiled from tweets

#84

Post by scarface74 »

throw0099 wrote: post #78
senordevnyc wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Oh, we’re trading anecdotes? Well, I know a lot of people, including many involved in hiring at various large tech companies, including myself. I’m sure they have programs to encourage diversity in hiring, but I seriously doubt they’re telling you they “blatantly discriminate” against white men and that white men have to perform much better in an interview in order to be hired. That’s an incomplete and simplistic sto…

Referral bonuses for women and minorities, and especially female minorities, are 5x what they are for white men at my company. They may not say "go discriminate against white men," but they certainly say "we will pay you a lot more to get us somebody who isn't a white man." I'm someone who really likes having diverse engineering teams, but that sort of practice is pretty distasteful and obviously not meritocratic.

I’m not making a statement either way about your post. But something that happen on HN with the introduction of Apple WatchOS 5 gives an example of why diversity is importance.

Apple added a feature in the latest version that helped women track their cycles. A few posters here couldn’t fathom why that was important.

Re: Developer salary spreadsheet compiled from tweets

#85

Post by eecc »

j7ake wrote: post #28

I always support disclosing salary information but I found it silly that the original tweet was prefaced with some greater goal of helping minorities or disadvantaged people. The subtext was clearly a flex to show how good developer salaries are in the USA, and by disguising it as doing some social good the tweet came off as distasteful. A person in Nigeria is not being helped by the person in US disclosing their sal…

Get off your white horse. While I do appreciate the difference in salary I also see the chasm in housing prices, quality of life, health insurance and so on...

Oh and where I live there’s no need to gaze away from the homeless living on the streets. Our taxes pay for many social workers doing their best

Re: Developer salary spreadsheet compiled from tweets

#86

Post by mattlondon »

rvz wrote: post #19
lowdose wrote: post #15

Just check https://levels.fyi also started out as a spreadsheet.

It only accounts for US salaries in dollars and those looking to relocate there. For those outside of the US, you're out of luck.

I think it has normalised the salaries to USD so that they can be compared easily. Many roles listing USD salaries are in locations outside of the US.

Re: Developer salary spreadsheet compiled from tweets

#87

Post by eecc »

DasIch wrote: post #73
quelltext wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Uhm, safety nets etc. do not really offset this. That's because Europe also has higher taxes though/autodeductions. When someone in Germany casually says 50k per year pre tax, they typically mean pre deductions (tax and social/health insurance) and the effective received money is more around 25k per year. People in the US underestimate how much of ones salary a European has to give up for that safety net.

50k per year pre tax in Germany, would end up being 30k after taxes. If you're married, you'd get substantial tax benefits and there are also benefits, if you have children.

Well those benefits still go towards payments you have to do anyway and it’s never 100%... (eg in NL you’d pay ~1k/month in childcare, and get back ~800. You’re still down ~2.5k/year)

Re: Developer salary spreadsheet compiled from tweets

#88

Post by eecc »

blueboo wrote: post #24
rvz wrote: post #4

What is this spreadsheet supposed to prove? It sounds like its either a ego-measuring contest of which company has the best salaries + compensation with position in a certain country (Hint: It's still FAAMNG in Silicon Valley) or it is a giant weird flexing spreadsheet to show that devs in developed countries are paid more that those in third-world countries (Even those who work remotely). The compensation in somewhe…

Oh, honey. Rents are equivalent in the UK, childcare isn’t free, prices are higher, and health care in the US hardly makes up the 100k+ difference.

Are they? In London perhaps, but so are salaries. Healthcare hardly makes a difference? How much does a natural birth cost in the US vs one in UK?

Re: Developer salary spreadsheet compiled from tweets

#89

Post by random314 »

theredlion wrote: post #43
j7ake wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are black and female software engineers in USA right now the demographic that really needs helping? Im not American, so I probably need clarification, but what is their current situation compared to white males in the same position at a company?

That's an interesting question. I'm personally aware of several large companies in my area which, due to diversity pressure, blatantly discriminate in favor of minorities and women. The performance required from a white man in an interview for the same job is higher. That is to say that a white man will be openly discarded in favor of a minority/woman with a similar background when applying for the same job. This is…

I am also personally aware of several large tech companies hiring practices in California. The statement above is completely false. Race and gender is explicitly asserted as a non factor in evaluation.

Re: Developer salary spreadsheet compiled from tweets

#90

Post by dbbk »

tchaffee wrote: post #8
rvz wrote: post #4

What is this spreadsheet supposed to prove? It sounds like its either a ego-measuring contest of which company has the best salaries + compensation with position in a certain country (Hint: It's still FAAMNG in Silicon Valley) or it is a giant weird flexing spreadsheet to show that devs in developed countries are paid more that those in third-world countries (Even those who work remotely). The compensation in somewhe…

It's useful to see what your peers are earning, especially for your next salary negotiation. And it's pretty obvious that if you don't live in SF, you shouldn't expect SF salaries.

Then use Glassdoor.
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