Privacy: Is That iPhone? • Hacker News Board

Re: Privacy: Is That iPhone?

#81

Post by peteretep » Wed, Nov 13, 2019, 2:58 AM UTC

mojuba wrote: post #48

varenc wrote: post #40

Mozilla suggests resetting the IDFA once per month...but that seems pretty trivial to workaround? If an app you used previously starts up and sees that your IDFA changed, it's easy for that app to know that the old IDFA and the new IDFA refer to the same user! This tracking is all possible because iOS gives every app on the device the same IDFA (advertising identifier [1]). They can then correlate all your activity a…

Unfortunately the majority of more or less useful or popular apps are also linked against various analytics/attribution platforms, often many of them at once. Mixpanel, Amplitude, AppsFlyer, Branch to name a few, plus Facebook and/or Google. In fact having any of the Google's or Facebook's SDKs means tracking, e.g. Maps, Login etc. Somehow these platforms have no problem with identifying users across their client app…

> Maybe it's not 100% precise, but as far as I can tell these companies keep so much information about us away from our eyes, that even the big guys (G, FB) would be jealous.

Ooooh, think of the GDPR fines!

Re: Privacy: Is That iPhone?

#82

Post by BurningFrog » Wed, Nov 13, 2019, 3:03 AM UTC

api wrote: post #53

mojuba wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Unfortunately the majority of more or less useful or popular apps are also linked against various analytics/attribution platforms, often many of them at once. Mixpanel, Amplitude, AppsFlyer, Branch to name a few, plus Facebook and/or Google. In fact having any of the Google's or Facebook's SDKs means tracking, e.g. Maps, Login etc. Somehow these platforms have no problem with identifying users across their client app…

Mobile is all about surveillance as near as I can see. The whole purpose of it is to track users.

There were mobile phones decades before any of this existed.

Re: Privacy: Is That iPhone?

#83

Post by shermozle » Wed, Nov 13, 2019, 3:17 AM UTC

varenc wrote: post #40

Mozilla suggests resetting the IDFA once per month...but that seems pretty trivial to workaround? If an app you used previously starts up and sees that your IDFA changed, it's easy for that app to know that the old IDFA and the new IDFA refer to the same user! This tracking is all possible because iOS gives every app on the device the same IDFA (advertising identifier [1]). They can then correlate all your activity a…

There is in fact just such an identifier, it's called IDFV. ID For Vendor. It's shared between all apps from the same vendor, so your Facebook and Instagram apps know they're on the same device.

Apple used to be quite strict that you had to actually have advertising in the app to ask for the IDFA permission. That seems to have disappeared.

Re: Privacy: Is That iPhone?

#84

Post by pault » Wed, Nov 13, 2019, 3:18 AM UTC

varenc wrote: post #2

To disable: Settings > Privacy > Advertising > Limit Ad Tracking You can also disable Location-Based Ads: Settings > Privacy > Location Services > System Services (at the bottom) > Location-Based Apple Ads Apple's ad tracking help doc: https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT205223 (Apparently they derive your gender based on your first name or the salutation on your iTunes account)

I just looked at the location tracking preferences and the default setting for Google maps is "always", as in "whenever your phone is on". O_o

Re: Privacy: Is That iPhone?

#85

Post by AYBABTME » Wed, Nov 13, 2019, 3:21 AM UTC

gorgoiler wrote: post #71

gruez wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm sorry, but that's some tin foil hat level paranoia with no basis in reality. What's your threat model here? That Apple wants to deanonymize HN posters by tying them to their screenshots? Considering that they own the operating system, they could skip all the complicated and detectable stenography-in-screenshots and smuggle your mobilesafari (or webkit, which all apps are forced to use) browsing history and cookie…

That’s fine, it’s not a big deal, though I was specifically asked. The main thing I would worry about is actually not Apple; instead (1) what information might Apple hide in plaintext in the image that a third party could extract?; and (2) what identifiers might there be that a third party could use to correlate multiple images as being from gorgoiler’s phone? But honestly it just feels odd to upload a screenshot wit…

Another reason could be: if you systematically scrub everything, then a third party wouldn't be able to use the fact that you scrubbed something as a hint that the thing had valuable information in it.

e.g.: if you use an encrypted chat app ONLY after a murder occurred, then this would be suspicious. If you always use encrypted chat apps, then there's no information hint being given about your possible involvement with the murder.

Re: Privacy: Is That iPhone?

#86

Post by jefftk » Wed, Nov 13, 2019, 3:24 AM UTC

jonplackett wrote: post #17

gorgoiler wrote: post #5

Finding the settings mentioned in the article is the sole dark pattern I can think of in iOS — when you find them it’s like finding a secret level in Super Mario Land. They are under Settings...Privacy...Advertising https://imgur.com/a/EOvUzCS The Advertising and Analytics options are only visible below the fold, if one scrolls down the privacy page. The fold itself is disguised as the bottom of the page to put you o…

Do you really think it's a dark pattern? What does Apple have to gain?

Apple benefits from a robust app market, and many apps are ad supported. This rolls up into more demand for iPhones.

Re: Privacy: Is That iPhone?

#87

Post by saagarjha » Wed, Nov 13, 2019, 3:25 AM UTC

pault wrote: post #84

varenc wrote: post #2

To disable: Settings > Privacy > Advertising > Limit Ad Tracking You can also disable Location-Based Ads: Settings > Privacy > Location Services > System Services (at the bottom) > Location-Based Apple Ads Apple's ad tracking help doc: https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT205223 (Apparently they derive your gender based on your first name or the salutation on your iTunes account)

I just looked at the location tracking preferences and the default setting for Google maps is "always", as in "whenever your phone is on". O_o

That's what you must have selected when you installed the app.

Re: Privacy: Is That iPhone?

#88

Post by zaroth » Wed, Nov 13, 2019, 3:31 AM UTC

ummonk wrote: post #12

gorgoiler wrote: post #5

Finding the settings mentioned in the article is the sole dark pattern I can think of in iOS — when you find them it’s like finding a secret level in Super Mario Land. They are under Settings...Privacy...Advertising https://imgur.com/a/EOvUzCS The Advertising and Analytics options are only visible below the fold, if one scrolls down the privacy page. The fold itself is disguised as the bottom of the page to put you o…

I think that depends on your device size. On my iPhone SE, the bottom-most row without scrolling is HomeKit, and that is only partially shown. A single scrolling swipe easily takes me to the end of the screen where the "Advertising" section lies.

Not just that, but the number of items in the list has grown overall. For example ‘File & Folders’ option is new in 13.

Re: Privacy: Is That iPhone?

#89

Post by Gaelan » Wed, Nov 13, 2019, 4:22 AM UTC

baroffoos wrote: post #72

fpgaminer wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In case people aren't aware, such a thing _is_ possible. Companies have used steganography techniques in the past to secretly embed identifiers into movies and other visual content. It's been used to track down the movie leakers, for example. Another example; most printers covertly embed an identifier in their prints. I have a vague memory of a pre-release video game doing it? Or maybe it was just debugging informati…

Microsoft embedded an ID in one of the animations on the xbox 360 dashboard which could identify the person who leaked video of a beta game.

Worth noting that, IIRC, this was never included in production/release builds of the dashboard.

Re: Privacy: Is That iPhone?

#90

Post by Gaelan » Wed, Nov 13, 2019, 4:24 AM UTC

ummonk wrote: post #12

gorgoiler wrote: post #5

Finding the settings mentioned in the article is the sole dark pattern I can think of in iOS — when you find them it’s like finding a secret level in Super Mario Land. They are under Settings...Privacy...Advertising https://imgur.com/a/EOvUzCS The Advertising and Analytics options are only visible below the fold, if one scrolls down the privacy page. The fold itself is disguised as the bottom of the page to put you o…

I think that depends on your device size. On my iPhone SE, the bottom-most row without scrolling is HomeKit, and that is only partially shown. A single scrolling swipe easily takes me to the end of the screen where the "Advertising" section lies.

On my 6S, the last item is "Research," and while it's pretty much fully on the screen, the margin below it is cut off enough that at least to me, it's obvious that there's scrolling to do.