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The China Cultural Clash

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Re: The China Cultural Clash

#81

Post by knzhou »

juanjmanfredi wrote: post #20

I'm curious as to what happens if the NBA does in fact get banned from China. I've always wondered whether, as the Chinese economy grows and living standards rise, individuals would ever feel more entitled to individual rights. Of course maybe this is just a western bias. If the NBA was blocked, would passionate Chinese NBA fans (of which there are many) fall in line? Or not?

I'm always bemused to have to say this, but: nobody likes censorship because they enjoy "falling in line". People everywhere support censorship exactly to the degree that they agree with the censors.

You probably didn't shed a tear when Alex Jones was deplatformed, because he's a scoundrel, and if this really did escalate to a full block of the NBA (which seems unlikely), by that point many Chinese citizens would probably think the same of the NBA.

Re: The China Cultural Clash

#82

Post by CharlesColeman »

seanmcdirmid wrote: post #39
ilamont wrote: post #17

Attempts by China to leverage market access into self-censorship by U.S. companies should also be treated as trade violations that are subject to retaliation. Thank you, Ben, for this honest appraisal which involves sticking out your neck and perhaps even harming your ability to travel to China or expand your business. Regarding this comment about Apple: And then there is Apple: the company is deeply exposed to China…

Note that Cook became CEO because of his logistics and operations work in China, so there is a lot of legacy to go on. Apple assembles iPhones in Brazil and I believe India now, but these are mostly for high tariff reasons. Much of what goes into an iPhone isn’t made in china (and what is made in China can easily be made elsewhere), but they are mostly made in east Asia, so having assembly done somewhere in the regio…

> However, whatever they would do would cost them, a cost they could pay if needed but probably not one they want to pay right now.

Apple probably should pay. They aren't a hardship case and being so dependent on an authoritarian regime isn't a good look right now [1]. Plus geopoltical risk is a thing and it would be smart for them to mitigate it.

[1] I have the world's smallest violin right here if they want to complain about screw manufacturing again. Didn't they setup all kinds of specialized factories in China already? They can build all the a screw factories they need.

Re: The China Cultural Clash

#83

Post by rtkwe »

onlyrealcuzzo wrote: post #50
seanmcdirmid wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Note that Cook became CEO because of his logistics and operations work in China, so there is a lot of legacy to go on. Apple assembles iPhones in Brazil and I believe India now, but these are mostly for high tariff reasons. Much of what goes into an iPhone isn’t made in china (and what is made in China can easily be made elsewhere), but they are mostly made in east Asia, so having assembly done somewhere in the regio…

But they don't own any factories, right? Wouldn't it destroy Foxconn and only defer revenue a bit for Apple? Maybe a few people who just gotta have the newest, latest, and greatest gadget will switch to a Flagship android because they can't wait for the new iPhone. But most people are pretty loyal / trapped into their mobile ecosystem. I doubt it would materially affect Apple's market share or their revenue long-term…

Apple would still have to find and build a relationship with a new assembly partner, that would cost a lot of money and most likely have some quality missteps along the way as the new partner trains employees and sets up quality control. That would take several months to a year to iron out all the kinks and in the mean time Apple would have very limited stock.

Re: The China Cultural Clash

#84

Post by [deleted] »

zarro wrote: post #41

I see lots of Anti-China sentiment. I would be very careful here into not falling into their deliberate trap of making "The West" China's "Enemy". China in its current totalitarian form needs an "Enemy" to survive, without it, it has to deal with difficult internal questions which will force it to adapt and change - and this what scares them. Totalitarian governments rely on distraction and misdirection of the popula…

[deleted]

Re: The China Cultural Clash

#85

Post by guelo »

zarro wrote: post #41

I see lots of Anti-China sentiment. I would be very careful here into not falling into their deliberate trap of making "The West" China's "Enemy". China in its current totalitarian form needs an "Enemy" to survive, without it, it has to deal with difficult internal questions which will force it to adapt and change - and this what scares them. Totalitarian governments rely on distraction and misdirection of the popula…

This theory has proved wrong. China has been welcomed into the WTO over the last 20-30 years and it has not reformed. It is now extending it's economic superpower into political and cultural power. It's not about making an enemy, it's about limiting this unwanted influence.

Re: The China Cultural Clash

#86

Post by brobinson »

zarro wrote: post #41

I see lots of Anti-China sentiment. I would be very careful here into not falling into their deliberate trap of making "The West" China's "Enemy". China in its current totalitarian form needs an "Enemy" to survive, without it, it has to deal with difficult internal questions which will force it to adapt and change - and this what scares them. Totalitarian governments rely on distraction and misdirection of the popula…

When the government has 100% control of the media that the population consumes, how can the "enemy" ever appear to be anything other than the enemy to the people? Anything the "enemy" does can be spun into an attack/insult/weakness/capitulation.

Re: The China Cultural Clash

#87

Post by baby »

nostromo wrote: post #26

It's frustrating to see people say that we shouldn't fight Chinese economic imperialism, mercantilism, and protectionism because we should support free trade. Free trade is a two way street. If a trading partner is engaging in unfair practices then it's reasonable to support sanctions and tariffs and other means to get them to stop, even if you're a free trade supporter. In fact this is the whole premise of the WTO,…

Tariffs are totally parts of trading, it’s negotiation on a different layer.

Re: The China Cultural Clash

#88

Post by mytailorisrich »

zarro wrote: post #41

I see lots of Anti-China sentiment. I would be very careful here into not falling into their deliberate trap of making "The West" China's "Enemy". China in its current totalitarian form needs an "Enemy" to survive, without it, it has to deal with difficult internal questions which will force it to adapt and change - and this what scares them. Totalitarian governments rely on distraction and misdirection of the popula…

> China in its current totalitarian form needs an "Enemy" to survive

Not at all. The whole premise of Chinese policy and the key to the Party's survival is not about fighting enemies. It's simply about developing the country and putting it on an equal footing with the other superpower(s).

Even if you watch or read the heavily controlled Chinese media, it's never about fighting anyone or pointing the finger at anyone. When that happens it usually in response to a perceived attack.

They know they have enough to do without inventing themselves enemies to fight against. Their policy is to avoid clashes as much as possible.

I should also point out that the condition of the Chinese 'populace' has massively improved over the last 40 years and they are actually quite proud of it.

Re: The China Cultural Clash

#89

Post by monkbent »

yorwba wrote: post #5
ETHisso2017 wrote: post #2

火箭, unlike the "Lakers", is a common Chinese word (rockets). Expecting it to dominate the trending hashtag on a Chinese social media site is a stretch.

Even worse, the search term in the image is "火影" (Naruto, EDIT: the series, not the character; the Chinese name of the series refers to https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Naruto_characters#Hoka... ). No wonder they're getting results completely unrelated to basketball.

This was a mistake, since fixed, but even then there are no basketball references

Re: The China Cultural Clash

#90

Post by mcphage »

AFascistWorld wrote: post #36

This is just inevitable, if it's not NBA, it could be any big company who gets caught in it, execs can pretend it will be all good and surely do wish this day comes as late as possible so they can make the most of it. This is like many things in the current world, vicious cycles, the more unsympathetic ordinary Chinese perceive outside China, the more they will embrace the CCP and strongmen, the more powerful the par…

> So there's only one question:

> Who's next?

Well, Blizzard, already. So more like, who's after that :-)

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