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The NBA Feels a Backlash in China After a Tweet Supporting Hong Kong

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Re: The NBA Feels a Backlash in China After a Tweet Supporting Hong Kong

#81

Post by beerandt »

saboot wrote: post #7

I am surprisingly conflicted. My strongest urge is to plainly say, screw them. China is a dictatorship, they are actively stomping out freedoms which I very much believe everyone living person had a right to. If they can't stand hearing the truth, fine, no NBA in China. In the back of my mind, I also recognize that isolation and division breeds more isolation and division. No NBA in China means less Western and Easte…

Stick with "screw them". The other option plays straight into their The Art of War type strategy.

Which is essentially: keep your enemies close and be their friend and milk them for all they're worth while learning their weaknesses then wait until you grow stronger than them and when they're vulnerable, you pounce.

Re: The NBA Feels a Backlash in China After a Tweet Supporting Hong Kong

#82

Post by throwaway1997 »

beerandt wrote: post #70
blondie9x wrote: post #16

Why can't Hong Kong just vote then we can end these protests? The people could vote for a leader who wants closer ties and one who wants more autonomy but let them vote and have a say in the matter. I do not think voting will lead to secession but maybe to a sense of freedom and the ability to influence direction of country.

You do realize: 1- voting got implemented over there only a few years before the handover. It's a relatively new and fluid concept to them. 2- industries/businesses get to vote. These are increasingly owned by China 3- China maintains veto power for any political candidates If only it were as simple as "just vote"

Even with our fake democracy, it's very common for people to buy votes from elderly people, who make up much of the population, and don't really understand democracy.

We have a lot of poverty here so it's very easy to buy votes by just hosting a dinner at a average restaurant, telling the people all the wonderful plans you have for HK then giving them a trinket to help them remember to vote for you.

Re: The NBA Feels a Backlash in China After a Tweet Supporting Hong Kong

#83

Post by brokensegue »

chadcmulligan wrote: post #56
khuey wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Short of an actual revolution no.

that to is up to the people of HK, if thats what it takes

by that argument everything is always "up the people". "well if they don't like $X they can always revolt."

revolt isn't a very flexible means of expressing the wills of the people.

Re: The NBA Feels a Backlash in China After a Tweet Supporting Hong Kong

#84

Post by XPKBandMaidCzun »

wei_jok wrote: post #54
XPKBandMaidCzun wrote: post #50

Hong Kong is definitely heading in the direction of complete independence. Thankfully. I agree completely that the angst in HK is caused by outsiders. It has to feel terrible for HK people having their representation grabbed by agents of Beijing. They should apologize and grant universal suffrage to all people born in HK. Most important in this is HK establishing its own military service, intel service, constitution…

This post does not represent what HKers involved in the movement want, which is autonomy (as per Basic Law), not independence.

You are right in regards to the current movement. In the 5 demands it says, "...implementation of universal suffrage for Legislative Council and Chief Executive elections"

Which could feasibly be done within the confines of the basic law. It is true many pro-democratic HKers don't want independence.

For some more context for those reading into it: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hong_Kong_independence vs https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2019_Hong_Kong_protests

But I should also be complete and let you know there is a fledgling and growing movement, the so-called "Republic of Cantonia", who believe all Guangdong should be break into its own nation. You can see the flag here: https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Flags_of_active_autonomis...

Re: The NBA Feels a Backlash in China After a Tweet Supporting Hong Kong

#85

Post by boomboomsubban »

chronic71819 wrote: post #60
boomboomsubban wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>China really needs to get a grip and understand that with seven billion people in the world, not everyone is going to agree with everything it wants 1.4 billion of those people are Chinese, and they can get outaged over whatever ridiculous shit they want.

> 1.4 billion of those people are Chinese, and they can get outaged over whatever ridiculous shit they want. Only in your own thoughts and dreams (for now). You're not allowed to outrage on Weibo or WeChat. Is this correct?

I highly doubt they'd object to people angrily repeating the state's position to an American country.

Re: The NBA Feels a Backlash in China After a Tweet Supporting Hong Kong

#86

Post by beerandt »

99chrisbard wrote: post #20
diego wrote: post #9

So many misunderstandings around this. For one, in the US we have free speech. That means that you can say anything you want, but you have to accept that you may lose customers for saying it. It doesn't matter if you believe that your customers shouldn't be pissed off. It's the Chinese in this case, but it could be any other relevant group. Second, perhaps because most Americans haven't been to China and cannot read…

> they gambled on the fact that they expected a very different future for China. Hong Kong was always going to return to China in 1997 due to a British-China deal. There's no way for HK to NOT return to China.

Technically the Hong Kong lease was perpetual, only the new territories lease expired in 97. But the British didn't want to deal with another partitioned colony, so they just gave up the whole thing.

Re: The NBA Feels a Backlash in China After a Tweet Supporting Hong Kong

#87

Post by 44595throw »

SpicyLemonZest wrote: post #48
supercanuck wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sure it is. One represents free speech in response to market participants making decisions. The other is an authoritarian government shutting down business ties based on one employee opinion. How do people not see the difference in this? On twitter, people are to speak whatever they want and can choose to buy whatever they want. In China. Not so much.

If the NBA were big in Spain, and the guy had said "Fight for Freedom, Stand with Catalonia", I expect he would have had to apologize too. The government is more involved in China, because the government is more involved with everything in China, but there are few countries in the world where people don't get mad at foreigners wading into touchy political issues.

Or if he had tweeted

"Fight for Freedom, Stand with Palestine"

I wonder what the reaction would have been?

Re: The NBA Feels a Backlash in China After a Tweet Supporting Hong Kong

#88

Post by bhy »

supercanuck wrote: post #80
bhy wrote: post #76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How do you know that? How many Chinese people have you talked with?

Because it is not democratically elected.

That's not logical. Democratic or not is an unrelated issue. The people can still be patriot on this matter.

Re: The NBA Feels a Backlash in China After a Tweet Supporting Hong Kong

#89

Post by brokensegue »

diego wrote: post #9

So many misunderstandings around this. For one, in the US we have free speech. That means that you can say anything you want, but you have to accept that you may lose customers for saying it. It doesn't matter if you believe that your customers shouldn't be pissed off. It's the Chinese in this case, but it could be any other relevant group. Second, perhaps because most Americans haven't been to China and cannot read…

A people of an area have a right to self determination. They never had a real opportunity to express that. So, why should they be forced to leave their home instead of just granting them this right?

What does the supposed "inevitability" of anything have to do with what should happen?

Any argument that employs "well just move if you don't like it" is probably wrong.

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