Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Shortchanging Your Business with User-Hostile Platforms

al3x.net

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

81–90 of 99 posts

Re: Shortchanging Your Business with User-Hostile Platforms

#81

Post by messel »

powdahound wrote: post #75
dools wrote: post #64

" It seemed like a decision that had everything to do with what’s in the best interests of the business, and nothing to do with what’s good for the customer. " They already told you they're a small team, with mostly windows users and AIR allowed them to offer a cross platform solution. This is a polite way of saying "you're an outlier, you're not our target user, please go away and stop bothering us". " People seem t…

Very well said, dools. I'm a co-founder of the app in question, which is HipChat ( http://www.hipchat.com ). If we'd started out making native apps for every platform we wouldn't be where we are today. Sure AIR isn't perfect but it's allowed a 3-man bootstrapped team to create a product that hundreds of companies love to use every day and are happy to pay for. Alex mentioned his team was going to try setting up their…

I rationally agree with the decision your team has made, but I realized I no longer have any AIR apps running on any of my systems. They've been unconsciously filtered out for native or web alternatives.

If your team does decide to build for a platform/OS I hope it's OS X first :D. Best of luck either way!

Re: Shortchanging Your Business with User-Hostile Platforms

#83

Post by nhangen »

al3x wrote: post #15
aditya wrote: post #11

This is a fascinating question. AIR and the new mobile app frameworks are great for prototyping and getting an app out there really quickly, and perhaps then you can make the decision to either build native apps for your biggest platforms; or not. Alex is obviously pointing to the verbal minority (of which he is a part), because for every person out there that speaks out against, say, the Tweetdeck AIR app; there are…

You can dismiss the "verbal minority", or you could treat them as leading indicators. Personally, I'll err on the side of building something that's up to my standards rather than seeing if I can get away with mediocrity. It's entirely possible to focus on both stability and, say, a quality desktop application. If you're under-resourced to accomplish both goals, maybe you didn't plan correctly.

If it is so easy, and you are unhappy with every available solution, then why not make one of your own?

Re: Shortchanging Your Business with User-Hostile Platforms

#84

Post by nhangen »

gruseom wrote: post #56
myth_drannon wrote: post #33

It's all about getting shit done and bringing value to clients. Design fetishism affects very small percentage of both users and builders (which are also sophisticated users)

"Design fetishist", by all accounts I've read, is an excellent description of Steve Jobs and Apple. Therefore design fetishism does not affect a small percentage of users.

The first Apple computer was shipped as a barebones circuit board...even Apple had to work their way to excellent UX.

Re: Shortchanging Your Business with User-Hostile Platforms

#86

Post by jarek »

jad wrote: post #58
aditya wrote: post #11

This is a fascinating question. AIR and the new mobile app frameworks are great for prototyping and getting an app out there really quickly, and perhaps then you can make the decision to either build native apps for your biggest platforms; or not. Alex is obviously pointing to the verbal minority (of which he is a part), because for every person out there that speaks out against, say, the Tweetdeck AIR app; there are…

In marketing circles, this "verbal minority" is referred to as "tastemakers": "One that determines or strongly influences current trends or styles" from: http://www.yourdictionary.com/tastemaker

I'm not sure I follow the connection from being "verbal minority" to being a "tastemaker". You can definitely be both, but just being one doesn't mean you're the other.

Re: Shortchanging Your Business with User-Hostile Platforms

#87

Post by dools »

gyardley wrote: post #69
dools wrote: post #64

" It seemed like a decision that had everything to do with what’s in the best interests of the business, and nothing to do with what’s good for the customer. " They already told you they're a small team, with mostly windows users and AIR allowed them to offer a cross platform solution. This is a polite way of saying "you're an outlier, you're not our target user, please go away and stop bothering us". " People seem t…

"People seem to hate AIR. Wherever you see AIR apps, there are support forum threads opened by customers begging for a native alternative" I've personally never noticed this, got any examples? In the post you're quoting, he linked to four forum threads for four separate products, along with a couple of blog posts.

Oops! Missed that sorry

Re: Shortchanging Your Business with User-Hostile Platforms

#88

Post by al3x »

dools wrote: post #64

" It seemed like a decision that had everything to do with what’s in the best interests of the business, and nothing to do with what’s good for the customer. " They already told you they're a small team, with mostly windows users and AIR allowed them to offer a cross platform solution. This is a polite way of saying "you're an outlier, you're not our target user, please go away and stop bothering us". " People seem t…

I genuinely enjoyed this comment. Really. It's probably the most passionate response I've received.

I was going to argue with you point-by-point, particularly about your false claim that I didn't include any examples (which another commenter addressed, and you acknowledged). At the end of it all, after a lot of flailing, I think this is really your thesis:

"Software is a constant process of settling for mediocrity."

I think we're just going to have to agree to disagree there. If that's how you approach what you do, then I understand your position. If that's your approach, then sure, AIR is a reasonable choice. That isn't my approach, and I think it's also not the approach of the people who, much to your befuddlement, keep upvoting this story and tweeting positively about the post.

Re: Shortchanging Your Business with User-Hostile Platforms

#89

Post by al3x »

arpit wrote: post #76

I really need to write a post on "Shortchanging your blog readers by spewing opinion but disabling comments". Whats with this? DaringFireball is the worst of the lot. Is this some new trend?

It's not a new trend. I haven't allowed comments on my blog for years. I want people to post thoughtful responses on their own turf. If someones care enough, they can respond on their own blog.

Re: Shortchanging Your Business with User-Hostile Platforms

#90

Post by laujen »

This is exactly the reason I have been rethinking the way my company develops apps. As the world splits and there isn't one standard technology like there used to be with Windows, I feel it is imperative to be thinking about how to go cross platform as quickly and easily as possible without cross platform tools. I think it means lighter native apps, simpler in design to do one specific task, and then more sophisticated tasks in the browser.
Post reply on HN