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Data scientists shouldn't use Upwork

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81–90 of 160 posts

Re: Data scientists shouldn't use Upwork

#81
post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you think it is not possible for race be related to job performance you must not have watched much NBA basketball.

The best athletes are extremely intelligent and driven people. The over-representation of black people in athletics is most definitely related to their under-representation in other fields.

I think it is less "intelligence" and more "naturally physically talented"

Re: Data scientists shouldn't use Upwork

#82
post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Excellent point! Isn't age a protected class though? At least in the US, discrimination over 40 is covered by the EEOC.

They are protected against certain kinds of discrimination, but no human discriminated against them. It was simply a dispassionate algorithm and an algorithm can't display malice! Grrr... or that's what they, and probably the courts, would say. The OP calling it "discrimination laundering" had it right.

> probably the courts, would say

The courts are the ones that created the doctrine of "disparate impact." A criterion can be discriminatory even if it doesn't look discriminatory on its face. And, importantly, it does not require intent to discriminate, only impact.

Re: Data scientists shouldn't use Upwork

#83
post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can't make effective prediction off this stereotype. It is useless. There is nothing inherent in "being black" that leads to greater basketball performance. Also, define "black," good luck. Being tall, maaaaaybe. But not perfectly so, and there's no useful correlation between tallness and race, considering that the NBA generally just selects for the most skilled basketball players. Then you get into all the cultu…

Aren't blacks genetically predisposed to larger twitch muscles (faster reaction times, etc.)?

Yea, happy to explore this.

First, what do you mean by "black people?"

Re: Data scientists shouldn't use Upwork

#84
post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Any tips for freelancers who are recent engineering grads? I have some portfolio items, but I still can’t claim more than 1 year experience

Spend a year working for a consulting company, to learn the ropes. If I were a business looking to have a freelancer build something for me, 'a fresh grad, with less than a year work experience, who has never done this sort of thing before' is not who I'd hire. I have 9 years experience, and if I were to to go into freelancing (The kind where you solve problems for businesses, as opposed to the kind where you're a 9-…

That's great advice. Even with quite a few years of experience at a large firm as a product manager, I was pretty clueless when I first switched to an industry analyst/consulting firm. This is spite of having been a client of said firms.

There's no way I would have known where to begin if I had just set out on my own.

Re: Data scientists shouldn't use Upwork

#85

I've been using UpWork for over a year now and never had a dispute so far. The author is right in saying that UpWork only guarantees payment when time tracking using their app. Where he is mistaken though is where he says that the app requires camera to be on at all times. There is such an option but personally I'd never go for a project like this. And yes, the app will take the screenshot of the stuff you are workin…

> I don't get why author's customer would launch a dispute over not completing a 10 minute survey.

... so they don't have to pay for the work?

Re: Data scientists shouldn't use Upwork

#86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Aside from 3/4 of your post being a gigantic ad about your own platform (which if you ever reached the scale of Upwork, I guarantee you’d run into the same issues you mention), how is it really a race to the bottom? You give the price you’re willing to work for, and the buyer agrees to the terms. Just like any other marketplace. I guess Fiverr is a race to the bottom, but that’s because their name and original missio…

> Aside from 3/4 of your post being a gigantic ad about your own platform I mention what I think is necessary for a platform in any vertical to work. We just happen to already be doing it for our vertical. > how is it really a race to the bottom? - Just about everyone has a 4.5+ star review, so the cheapest 4.5+ star review looks objectively better to a Co trying to cut costs. Just like any review system, it can be g…

When I vet candidates I do an image search on their profile photo, look at their resume (and other projects they’ve done on the platform), along with the number of hours worked on the platform. Focusing only on a rating system is short-sighted.

Re: it being an imbalanced marketplace in favor of customers, I guess you’d also say the same about eBay?

I understand your motive is driven to compete with Upwork, but it’s the most built-out and legitimate platform out there, and given their size, I trust them over some smaller operation.

P.S.: I read the OP’s naive writeup. He didn’t follow the platform rules and was surprised that it went against him. Shocking. $400 is a lesson to do more research next time.

Re: Data scientists shouldn't use Upwork

#87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

UpWork doesn't do filming using your camera, only takes a picture every ~10 minutes. Also the picture taking is optional and can be disabled by client (Throughout 1 year working on UpWork I never had a project which required of me the camera bit). The screenshot taking is required for payment protection.

> UpWork doesn't do filming using your camera, only takes a picture every ~10 minutes. And how can I, the person being filmed, verify that?

Get a camera where the activity LED turns on when camera is active.

Re: Data scientists shouldn't use Upwork

#88
post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you think it is not possible for race be related to job performance you must not have watched much NBA basketball.

The best athletes are extremely intelligent and driven people. The over-representation of black people in athletics is most definitely related to their under-representation in other fields.

Given how small a population “best athletes” is (..by definition), I somehow doubt this.

Re: Data scientists shouldn't use Upwork

#89
post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Aren't blacks genetically predisposed to larger twitch muscles (faster reaction times, etc.)?

Yea, happy to explore this. First, what do you mean by "black people?"

In America?, any person self described as one, or with a significant (25%+) component of the Niger-Condorfanian cluster as per [1]. I agree the definition is arbitrary but all definitions are. The same with "tall" people. We could discuss all day long who is or isnt tall, or we could define tall as being at least 6ft 2in or whatever.

[1] https://science.sciencemag.org/content/324/5930/1035

Re: Data scientists shouldn't use Upwork

#90
> This was the first task I ever received and it flickered my curiosity. In the problem set, the dataset contained survey and demographic attributes like race, age, computer proficiency, immigration status….etc.. to predict actual work performance.

> I completed the survey which was asking me workplace situational questions testing my unconscious biases and then quickly rejected the dispute.

This sounds like the "consulting company" was someone running a scientific experiment to see who is willing to create racist/ageist/otherwise unethical models.

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